i don't quite understand your point, but i guess we both try to prove the same thing: even though the optimal risk looks high, and even though it may be 20% or 40%, even though if you got hits in a streak, if you can keep risking the same high %, you will win in the end. <b> Assuming you will actually win that is </b> in my example, if you lose 20% 20% 20% 40%, you will only have 30% left, but you will still end up 100% gain after 12 tries. <b> right </B> i personally hold 150% of my buying power in stocks, overnight for 3 years, and my return is great. now i trade futures and i use 90-100% of my margins, but i keep my portfolio diversified. i think average risk of 20%-33% is not too large even if your win:loss ratio is only 2:1 and winsize/losssize is 1:1. <b> NOT at all, if you have a small account......meaning under $1 mil or smaller.....but if you are an institution it is completely different ball game </B>