Writings During The Life of Jesus Prove His Existence?

Discussion in 'Religion and Spirituality' started by BernardRichards, Jun 2, 2008.

  1. Well, yes, if you want to get technical. Technically, there is no need for a savior because there is no such thing as guilt, relative to reality. I "take away the sins of the world" simply by telling you that. However, "Adam" did not believe himself to be guiltless and condemned himself on trumped up charges. *Adam* would be a symbol of consciousness. Man is a descendant, so-to-speak, of a guilty conscience.

    Consciousness, despite its conotations, is not completely *aware*. It is the first step away from reality. It arises upon the denial of reality. The denial of reality is fundamentally what *sin* is. Reality is the Son of God...so consciousness is a denial of Self.

    Pronouncing itself guilty, consciousness invents *fear* of reprisal. It conjures up corresponding feelings. It then *hides* to protect its "self". It reproduces itself inthe same way it was born: limited, separated, guilty, scared, alone. Consciousness does not exist. To maintain itself, it makes this world as *proof* of it's existence. The world is designed to keep truth out since truth is the greatest threat to it's existence.

    "Man" is the offspring, so-to-speak, of consciousness. Consciousness was born of a split mind, and reproduces itself by splitting. Hence, "woman" splits off from "man". Children are produced by the splitting of cells, splitting off from the mother at birth...splitting from parents when they "move out", and splitting from mankind whey they *die*. Splitting makes no sense. Eve may as well have come from Adam's rib. The "myth" about splitting is most apparent in this story.

    The false concept of guilt is deeply embedded in the consciousness of man. The appearance of the body and all of its actions stem from a deep belief in guilt. Guilt originates man's experience...originating with consciousness itself which produces man as a mental image...an outpicturing of imagination.

    Man is pretty much an 11 dimensional cartoon character. So it seem "real". He acts out the edicts of consciousness, much like a puppet. Consciousness is all about crime and punishment. It shifts the concept of guilt onto man and proceeds to kill him. In this way, man is killed by his own beliefs, embedded deep within consciousness, which hides itself in man's mind as his "subconscious", rendering him unconscious. It's pretty wicked if you asked me.

    So a "savior" takes away the sins of the world simply by telling the truth: Guilt is an untrue concept conjured up by a split mind. When the truth is repeated over and over, it "washes away" the belief in guilt embedded in the dark cracks and crevices of the subconscious. This sets man "free" of time and space.

    Guilt produces a linear experience of time, which is technically more like a holograph. Think: one bad apple. The body itself is a time machine, made to worm its way through a consciousness which looks back over its shoulder for a posse of law, and looks forward at the inevitable "justice" that must befall it.

    Anyone who believes, as "Adam" believed, that God kicked him out of the garden of Eden [the Kingdom of God] as a matter of justice...will die. Because this is basically a denial of reality. And reality is Life. Man does believe this, because consciousness believes it. Though this belief is hidden, death is evidence it still resides in mind.

    Once reality is denied, its opposite comes into play. Death and guilt are opposites of Life and holiness. It is not true that man was ever intended to "live". His whole purpose is to express Life's opposite. He "lives" only in comparison to death. But what can die was never alive. Man's entire existence, then, is an illusion. The truth dispells the errors of consciousness which produce the "man" phenomenon, rendering man obsolete. Therefore, "man" and truth are at odds until truth is accepted. By accepting the truth, "man" lays down his alledged "life", and thereby comes to Life again.

    A savior is one who informs the deluded of the truth. Would the deluded be able to excise themselves from this predicament without it? Not at all. Therefore, your savior could be your next door neighbor. If you accepted the fact that your neighbor is your self, you would know the truth and be saved. This truth is resisted because it renders obsolete the very idea of "man", which is the expression of autonomous will, separated from the one will of the Father and the Son. Mah interupts the sharing of the Kingdom through communion. Hence, the feeling of guilt. Man blocks communication. So he potentially blocks creation. That is how the problem is seen by the Holy Spirit.

    Salvation begins with the creation of the Holy Spirit, and proceeds through your neighbor. I am your neighbor. Depending on how you percieve me, I am your savior or your prison keeper. The truth is, there is no sin. Therefore, there is no world, no man, and nothing guilty. It's all a hypothetical made-up story, believed in by a powerful mind, and made "real". Yet the "reality" of the world will never defeat or change the truth, which cannot be destroyed by insane notions made flesh.

    Believe me and you will live, and not taste death any longer. It will cost you everything you think you have, which is nothing. The world is nothing. Man is not sacred. If you divest yourself of these things, you will have treasure indeed. Then, with this treasure, you will have enough to give to the poor. The poor are simply those who have invested without profit in what is unreal.



    Jesus
     
    #31     Jun 5, 2008




  2. Go ask any SERIOUS historical scholar at an Ivy League school - and then get back to me


    Haha guys like you crack me up. 'Not enough written records, we demand more specific evidence, not vague oral traditions passed down from generations!'

    Answer me this: 'Do you believe that Alexandar The Great existed?

    If you are going to say 'yes', then you better say Jesus existed because there is MORE historical evidence backing up Jesus than Alexandar The Great.


    Nice sophistry there. I said Jesus divides and causes CONFLICT.

    I did NOT say: 'Jesus wants you to engage in physical VIOLENCE.'

    People complain about Christians: 'Just leave me alone, I do my thing!'

    Jesus never did that, he went around and challenged people. He challenged their beliefs - he never forced them to accept his own beliefs, but he definitely made sure his opinions were heard loud and clear. And this of course caused huge divisions. Jesus was never: 'You're ok, I'm ok, whatever you believe in is ok with me as long as we all get along peacefully.' Jesus' goal was not peace, his goal was to bring the truth (as he so saw it) to everyone.


    "Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household." (Matthew 10:34-36 NASB)


    "I have come to cast fire upon the earth; and how I wish it were already kindled!" ... "Do you suppose that I came to grant peace on earth? I tell you, no, but rather division; for from now on five members in one household will be divided, three against two and two against three."... (Luke 12:49,51-53 NASB)
     
    #32     Jun 5, 2008
  3. Peace be with you.

    There is no peace in the world, because it was made out of conflict in the mind, which has been expressed as physical violence. This expression cannot be "fixed" because the world stands upon a false foundation of a hypothetically split mind. This is the "house divided against itself" which cannot stand. Therefore the world represents a "fall", and there is disociation and denial between the two systems of thought. Each system of thought is insane to the other. The only way to solve the conflict is to remove the world from your awareness...put it out of your mind. It is a "beam" in your eye that blinds vision of reality and causes you to "sin". The world is a battleground. In war, the first casualty is the truth. Truth restores peace. So the world must go.

    "Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives". The world gives merely a truce, or temporary cease-fire. It makes laws regulating commerce and intercourse. But these do not solve the problem at the cause level which is mental conflict. Salvation is for the mind, for peace of mind, which only the truth can bring.

    "Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid." The truth can be troubling. It can be upsetting to your status quo. It turns the tables on everything you believed. So it can make you afraid. However, there is no reason to be afraid of reality.

    "I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace. In this world you will have trouble. But take heart! I have overcome the world."

    "Sword" is a symbol which "rightly divides the word of truth". This simply means that when you have the truth, and understand it correctly, you may discern between what is true and what is false. The whole world is false, including the concept of children, parents and family. Thus, I have said, "call no man 'father'". The idea of human family exists in your own mind as a belief. It stems from the belief in separation. The truth allows you to separate these beliefs from what is true. What is true is these are your self. As a human family, they express a false self-concept, defining you as a "baby", "child", "son", "teen", "adult"...all of which are false self-concepts. It is through family, neighbors and mankind generally that you maintain false self-concepts about Self.

    To "know thySelf" you must understand first the truth. You are not a "man". The truth cuts this concept off because it causes you to "sin", that is, to deny reality...your reality as the Son of God. Without reality - Christ - there is nothing. Hence, man is nothing. Therefore, cut it off from your belief structure. "Renounce" the "reality" of "man" and "family", for these symbolize multiplicity and special status which are of this world. These will never bring peace.

    If you understood that you are one with what appears to be your brother or your sister or your mother or father, you begin to take off the mask which veils the *face of Christ* [patent pending :)] from your vision. This "threatens" your families individuality and special status symbolized by false terms such as "mother", "father", "little sister", "baby brother"...etc. This may or may not "fly" with them, because these self-concepts are held dearly. So there may or may not be resistance. The experience of resistance is not the aim or objective. It is not necessary. All that matters is the truth. In this way you *love* your neighbor. Any other way is not really *love*, rather, it is to experience fantasy. Give them their true identity and you will be given in return yours. Whether they accept it or not is up to them. You shall have your reward regardless.

    Jesus
     
    #33     Jun 5, 2008
  4. saxon

    saxon

    It has been widely accepted by mainstream scholars for quite some time that Jesus was not headline news in his day. Had there been a daily newspaper in Jerusalem, the Crucifixion probably wouldn't have made page 1.

    This is nothing new.
     
    #34     Jun 5, 2008
  5. Quote from Gringinho:

    Wow, I really must reconsider my notion on history in the area. They probably did have super-sized brains and were much more intelligent than the rest of us ... Do you think they specifically bred the really smart ones?

    Are you really that much of an imbecile? [yes, I guess so]

    When something is a critical part of their culture, they get very good at it. We don't depend on oral tradition; we read instead of memorize. It is a cultural SKILL, little man. It has nothing to do with a larger BRAIN, little man. Did you get your diploma off a cereal box?

    But I tell you what. We will test your theory on ANOTHER no longer used human skill.

    Go on out and make a complete set of stone/bone tools, including axes, needles, scapers. Make a spear and spear thrower. Of course, a good bow and arrows that actually WORK well. Make yourself a campfire from flint. Go out and catch some animals. Forage off the land (no books, of course). Make yourself some skins, etc. etc. You get the idea.


    What can have caused this brain-shrink in the rest of us, if that's not the case?

    No, just in your case

    Where are these superminds nowadays - can we see any traces in descendants or was it all a divine gift?

    Dummy, if you only had one tenth of the brainpower of a squirrel, it would be an amazing thing.

    I mean, if I don't adhere to your view I'm worthless ... should I blame my mother or father for being born such?

    I am sure they are already terribly embarrassed that they had you.
     
    #35     Jun 5, 2008
  6.  
    #36     Jun 5, 2008
  7. Why did rcanfiel get banned?
     
    #37     Jun 5, 2008
  8. Thomas walked with me and quoted/mentions me extensively. Why is his witness not in the 'official' cannon? Why did someone think to bury it in order to protect it? The fact is, there was a purge by an increasingly authoritarian ecclesiastical heirarchy. Early documentation was as valuable then as it is now. It was also damaging to the case for Pauline theology which had surpassed the truth in popularity.

    Paul began 20 years after my resurrection, based on hear-say. He heard, for example, Stephen say many things, before assisting in his stoning. Stephen had first-hand [not hear-say] documentation as well. As christianity evolved, Stephen's documentation no longer fit the mold and was destroyed as a threat, despite its role in the revised composition of the "synoptic" [copy and paste] gospels. These are the gospels of guilt and limitation, whereas, the originals were gospels of innocence and freedom. Guilt is not really good news, whereas, innocence was indeed the good news. Though Paul was gravely mistaken, one may consider his escapades as historical. Who, though mistaken, puts in that much energy promoting a non-entity? He did not understand what the symbol was, or what it represented. Yet his belief in its manhood and miracles is hardly questionable.

    Having said that, history is a trick of time, which contains every iteration upon the hypothetical theme of separation, division, diversity and confusion. History is irrelevant to the truth. All truth is now. Past and future cannot touch it.

    This is more of an underground, grass-roots well-spring movement. It's something that starts small and grows as an awakening gradually dawns upon the consciousness of man as more of them think of the truth. Truth will not displace man without his consent. Truth will not take away what is yet desired [the world] without agreement. Truth will not impose itself without invitation. It will not grab you with miracles without a welcome. It respects man's will to experience a conceptual fantasy. Yet as truth is accepted, it's influence spreads more rapidly because the mind is really one.

    In the next 100 years, the doctrine I am documenting here will spread at a rate faster than Pauline judeo-christianity spread any time in it's first few hundred years. So here is an example of a grass-roots, underground awareness. Is it making news? Are any historians picking it up? Has the blogosphere sniffed it out yet?

    Jesus
     
    #38     Jun 5, 2008
  9. Shoeshineboy is not ignoring me. He just hasn't disagreed.

    Jesus:D
     
    #39     Jun 6, 2008
  10. We must be talking about two different Jesus' Epiphany (Revelation). Yours is one of discord and conflict, and mine is one of concord and peace.

    "Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you." (John 14:27)

    "I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace." (John 16:33)

    "If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone." (Romans 12:18)

    "Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification." (Romans 14:19)

    "Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God." (Matthew 5:9)

    Now for the $1,000,000 question Epiphany (Revelation), what is your purpose here at Elite Trader to cause divisions and conflict or to bring peace? :)


    BTW, Epiphany (Revelation) have I provided you with a sufficient sample of scholars that question the existence of a historical Jesus?
     
    #40     Jun 7, 2008