The advantage in trading NYSE stocks is for the house. i.e. Broker. Small moves = more commissions. Open orders = more commissions. Pair Trading = more commissions. Buying 10,000 shares of Nasdaq stock for a total commission of $9.95 +$25.00 (ISLD - if removing liquidity) and sitting in the trade all day and selling for 30 cents loss to 1 point profit makes no commissions and therefore not recommended Holding overnight is not recommended either why not close and open again the next day and pay more commissions Think about it. If you are in any business, wouldn't you sell the product that makes YOU the MOST money. In this case NYSE is what's being sold. I personally disagree that NYSE is more liquid or better to do business with. My take is as so: Trading is reward to risk business. What difference does it make what market you trade as long as you manage risk properly? And for those who said NYSE is more liquid, take the top 50 most actives: http://www.edreyfus.com/cgi-bin/cgipage?TAG=06MKTW+nymac http://www.edreyfus.com/cgi-bin/cgipage?TAG=06MKTW+otcmac Total the volume and see for yourself. NYSE is not even close to NASDAQ volume. Oh ... and I think no prop firm wants to teach this: http://hardrightedge.com/work/orderrouting.htm too many options and let's face it, most of us are not "gifted enough" to learn all these routing options Hey, I trade both and I started as an NYSE only trader. Maybe I learned a couple of things ... hmmm.... I think I have. I strongly feel that Nasdaq stocks provide BETTER reward to risk Opportunities. And let's face it, if a trader can't employ a winning money management system, he is going to fail trading either market. It just might be a slower more painful journey trading NYSE only and at the end it will be the broker keeping most of his money rather than the successful traders on this board. The question is who would he rather lose his money to - the broker or the Nasdaq traders Here it comes: I personally would NEVER recommend anyone to open an account where he is restricted to trading what the broker thinks is in "his" best interest. A trader should have an opportunity to profit from both markets period! ~ just my 2 cents worth(less) ... Good Trading and trade the market or markets that best work for you and not the ones recommended by salesman. Tony Oz
I can understand asking a new member to demonstrate consistent profitability with the system they use before granting the big-time leverage, and would feel more comfortable in a firm that does this, but I don't need them telling me which markets to trade - unless they have a better system than me and then I'll be glad to use it . Didn't think any firm would operate like that, but I'll be sure to ask that question in the future just in case. Don't need to be limited to one market, just like I don't need someone standing over my shoulder telling me I'm not trading enough.
Most of the prop firms do not offer adequate software to trade Nasdaq stocks! The handicapping factor for traders is not their ability as much as lack of good software and training on order routing. Here comes another one ... I would not recommend anyone to ever open an account with a prop firm which does not offer the full-blown version of RealTick With the commissions they charge, this is the least they can do for you. Now that I got this off my chest, it's family time. Good Trading, Tony
Thanks for the information on the LU trader. When I am in the mood for trading NYSE stocks, LU is the one for me. Don't know why I like this stock, but I do. I did see 5700sh go off today, could of been your LU trader. Myself, I like trading Nasdaq and NYSE. But mostly Nasdaq. I am in the process of learning NYSE because it is interesting and not so darn volatile.
I agree totally, all firms who cater to independent traders should allow their people to trade whatever market they feel comfortable with. Traders should fully understand how the game is played and pick which markets they want to trade ...no matter what. Certain strategies work better on listed than Naz, and vice-versa. Trader profits are the single most important thing to any firm. Trader retention on primary, and traders only continue to trade when they make money.
Just some numbers that might make sense to most of you. The average trader does approximately 400 shares per trade at a cost of 3.60 with no ECN fees. Average trader executes about 90 trades per day, so if you save 6.50 or so per trade x 90 = (roughly) $600 in savings per day x 20 days = nearly $12,000 per month savings ($144,000 year). Also, "big size trader" is capped out at $25 so he can trade 20,000 shares fo $25...not bad. New trader (100 shares while learning) pays only 1.00 per trade. I really doubt that many traders actually trade 10,000 shares per trade very often on 1 ticket on the Nasdaq, so partial fills would add up considerably. Tony's point is valid for a highly experienced, well capitalized, trading customer of a firm (don't get me wrong, I do agree with him for his own trading), but for the rest of the world there may be better options. Add in the free use of intraday capital, the prop option makes sense to a very wide audience. Not trying to argue, just pointing out some applicable data.
For many traders NYSE is the place to trade. If you trade NASDAQ, the NYSE seems like it's trading in slow motion. The NYSE offers increased liqudity, lower volatility(most of the time) and price improvement using limit & mkt orders. Most top traders in our firm trade only NYSE. I do have one suggestion for NASDAQ traders who are thinking of trading NYSE-try using the route NYSE NX, which is the NYSE auto-ex. While not a true auto-ex like an ECN match , the NX route offers execution in 1-10 seconds for orders 1099 shares are less. Our top NYSE traders use NYSE NX 80% of the time, with excellent results.There are some restrictions for using NX. The REDI site has updated NX rules at www.redi.com/apr12.html . If you trade NYSE, you will have the routes NYSE,NYSE NX and ISLD on most edat platforms-so NYSE speed of executions are improving. Gene Weissman Lieber & Weissman Sec., L.L.C. gweissman@stocktrade.net
I've seen the term "price improvement" used alot on these boards by NYSE traders. What exactly is your definition of this? Because my take on it is - (all due respect here) maybe a term used to hype NYSE trading. ECNs - when I try to hit a bid or ask on the L2s I know I'll get filled almost instanty (granted you gotta be quick sometimes, and not so lucky in a fast moving mkt). I know that I can very likely take that price immediately. Less uncertainly, there has got to be some value in that. Putting in a NYSE order, in that 10 sec (or whatever) delay waiting for a fill, maybe the market moves away. A NYSE Auto-ex sounds good, but I typically go over the (I think it was 1099) share limit.. Not to knock NYSE trading, I think anyone should use what works for them.
esc_trader, If the market is 50.20Bid X Offer50.30 and I send an order to Buy 5000 GM at 50.30, I might get my order completed a at 50.25 by a seller(floor broker) in the crowd or the specialist. NASDAQ is a fragmented market and this will never happen. The example I gave is a true 10,000 up market, the .01 spreads shown are not always true size markets. The NYSE and NASDAQ are really two different markets. If you are use to the "speed" of NASDAQ ECN fills, NYSE trading takes a while to get used to. I might Buy a stock on NYSE NX and offer the stock above the market on ISLD and get taken out when a stock is "running". There is money to be made on the NYSE once you get used to the specialist system . NYSE trading is not for everyone. I would suggest you trade either NYSE or NASDAQ, not both. Gene Weissman Lieber & Weissman Sec., L.L.C. gweissman@stocktrade.net
You can get price improvement on Nasdaq. If a stock is 50.20 x 50.30 on Nasdaq, and you go to buy 1000 at 50.30 on Island with a hidden order on Island that's offering 1000 at 50.25, you will get filled at 50.25, thereby receiving price improvement.