Sent a pm, but for everyone else too: On the thinkorswim.com website under "why think or swim" and click "rate, commissions, and fees" the listed rate for EX/Rates#2 for Options is .95 per contract with a 19.95 minimum per leg so if you are trading more than 20 contracts then it is worth it. I know they can go a little lower than that but you have to do a lot more than 20 contracts. That is an all in rate with no software or quote charges. Not the lowest you can get but with their customer service being the best in the industry it is not too bad. So you would need to be doing 20+ contracts per trade, as in a single trade of 20 contracts or a 20 lot IC (which would be 20*4 legs=80 contracts). As I have said before, if you want low rates and are a small trader then TOS may not be the best fit. As to PM at IB vs. TOS, it is simply not true that they are the same. IB is more restrictive overall, but it depends on the actual position you are talking about. Backing the statement up, as someone asked for, it a waste of time. I have yet to find anyone who actually understands PM disagree with the statement, and it is not worth the time to teach that person PM.
Wow another blanket statement with no support! You're not looking very hard! It's the same answer I gave when my son asked me why the sky is blue! PM is not very difficult. I model my PM with OX all the time so that I can understand it. I have compared IB's directly with OptionsXpress. OX uses 18% as it's standard movement for PM with Options selling. That is, the portfolio is usually tested by 18% moves of the underlying stock. However, for many stocks that OX deems volitile, OX uses movements of up to 50%. I have found that IB uses 15% for it's movement for those stocks I tested. So I believe IB Portfolio Margining is better than OX as it gives you more money to work with which is the whole benefit of PM. What percentages does TOS use or is that a little too complicated for ya. (It was for the TOS customer service) How is IB more restrictive in it's portfolio margining? Are you referring to the Concentration penalty? This penalty goes away with just a few positions and doesn't seem to be a big deal. So, I'm just breathless waiting to hear why TOS has better PM than IB because I'll like a real reason to go over and try TOS again as I hear such good things about them (over and over again $19.95 for a 20 contract option. What a deal! IB customers will pay $14 for that trade. Even the big traders every now and then might prefer to do say smaller trades (say 3 contracts) Well IB, that would be $2.10. Hmm what would TOS charge for that? Now that I'm with IB, it's nice being able to trade whatever size contract I want without the worry in the back of my head of wasting money due to commission minimums. With other brokers, I find I trade 10 contracts, not because it is right for my trading, but simply to meet their minimums! (Is that really a good way to size your trades?) Like I said, I WANT to try TOS as it seems quite the rave these days. It seems to have all the Bells and Whistles, but then I think about all the money I'm saving throgh commissions and interest paid with IB. Making the argument for TOS based on ease of use, interface, graphs, etc... are all very valid and legitimite, but you start losing credibility when you compare TOS's commissions with IB, because they are NOT comparable.
Thatâs nice for you joeactuary, we get it, you love IB. I have stated over and over again IB and TOS are very different companies and always will be. I can't imagine why a professional trader would waste time with anything as small as a 20 lot. People like you are the exact reason the life long professionals don't bother posting here much, too many ridiculously egotistical know nothings pounding their chest about everything. Your post contains so much ignorance I actually laughed out loud reading it, so for that I thank you, laughter is always good. Don't bother replying to me, you don't actually understand PM, I am not going to teach it to you, and I don't care what you do or why you do it. Feel free to believe what you want, IB has good customer service, they will work with you on any problems, they have better PM rules, their charts are great, the moon landing never happened, and the earth is flat.
well since i have pm accounts at both ib and tos, i am qualified when saying that tos' provides more leverage. this thread is about options not stocks, and for options, tos' pm gives better leverage for most positions. the only options position that's comparable between them would be a riskless one such as a conversion, but most of us don't trade those. for everything else -- verts, flies, uncovered, etc, tos' pm wins. anyone who says the two are the same has never traded options on both platforms. they're like night and day in terms of leverage and how much they respond to movement in the underlying. ib's is closer to reg-t than it is to tims.
This is a fascinating discussion. It always amazes me to see the wide variety of opinions on the various brokers out there.
it is rare to have a poster have pm in with both companies; so good analysis. i am pm with ib only and have been with them since before et was such a big deal. to me i like ib for many reasons; such as clean professional approach, good margin, breadth of products, price, technology, etc. also, many broker dealers in new york city use ib too , which to me says much. besides, with tos and others doing options; this competition will imo further keep ib pushing to stay ahead. where else can you get .70 for options all in? also, do you think the owners of tos are in the same league as ib? take leverage out (if that is anyone's misguided criteria) and ib wins hands down. having cross margining , etc is nice; but they never tell you when you overleverage til it's too late..so be careful.
I get so tired of "great customer service" and "their support stinks" and all of that general crap. As a newb, I really want some good feedback as to why one broker is better than the other. There are good arguments here, and I'm torn on making a decision.
The various brokers have been compared numerous times here. You can also read the reviews. That's about it, the rest is up to you! Nobody is gonna hold your hand and tell you to pick a particular broker. It all comes down to what features you value most.
Is IB .70 all in or .70 + exchange fees which can be significant depending on where the order is executed? Thanks.