Where to trade with pik bonds?

Discussion in 'Trading' started by lojze, Mar 16, 2017.

  1. Well, you'd be surprised how many of the "big, fat boys" wouldn't touch this stuff with a bargepole...
     
    #11     Mar 16, 2017
  2. lojze

    lojze

    How about Ameritrade?
     
    #12     Mar 16, 2017
  3. newwurldmn

    newwurldmn

    I did some reading. Isn't it for all practical purposes a bond that pays its interest with more bonds (like a stock paying a stock dividend)? What makes it toxic? Seems like a version of a zero coupon bond.
     
    #13     Mar 16, 2017
  4. I believe it is just added to the principal on the bond essentially. So a 10% PIK bond/Loan on a million they would owe you $1.1m after year one then $1.21m year 2. It compounds against them essentially, but they don't have to pay you anything until maturity.

    Not 100% on that, but from what I've read that is how they are typically structured.
     
    #14     Mar 16, 2017
  5. It's just that this sorta thing is normally associated with a spiral into distress. Once you PIK, you're not very likely to come back to normality. That means that there are lots of devils in details and everything is on a case-by-case basis. Needless to say, this isn't good for turnover, liquidity etc etc...

    As someone put it, "First they pay, then they PIK and then they die."
     
    #15     Mar 16, 2017
  6. just21

    just21

    The Glazers bought Manchester United with PIK bonds. Turned into a good deal for them.
     
    #16     Mar 16, 2017
  7. Eventually, yes... I am not sure if all the craziness and the hatred of supporters was worth it in the end.
     
    #17     Mar 16, 2017
  8. newwurldmn

    newwurldmn

    I see.
     
    #18     Mar 16, 2017
  9. donnap

    donnap

    Supposedly, there are some preferred stocks out there that behave like PIK bonds.

    Not my area of interest, though.
     
    #19     Mar 16, 2017