what SSF trades closest to the S&P 500?

Discussion in 'Financial Futures' started by FRuiTY PeBBLe, Apr 14, 2003.

  1. Yeah, so I'm thinking ES is a little too big for my account size. :( SPY would be perfect, BUT THE GOD DAMN PDT RULES SCREW ME AND PISS ME OFF! :mad:

    So then I was thinking about trading a SSF that trades similar to the S&P 500. Does anyone know what SSF trades closest to it?


    FRuiTY P.
  2. DIA`s SSF, Hii told me about that one last week
  3. DIA has an SSF ? What about SPY or QQQ ?
  4. SPY`s dont...QQQ`s I do not know
  5. interesting. i face a similar issue, wanting to trade an index, but not feeling ready to use the leverage needed for ES. I was also looking at the SSF's for a suitable proxy. I noticed IWM, the russell 2000 etf has an SSF also.

    imo you're probably better off with those pdt rules anyway on spy. if you're trading less than 25k, you'll have to assume inordinate risk to make any worthwhile profit in the pdt timeframe.
  6. I should make this decision, not some regulator. It's my f***ing money and my f***ing life (anger not directed at you). It's definitely possible to make money daytrading SPY with an account <$25k.

    F. P.
  7. Right. Get the S.E.C. off your back by quitting the stocks and stock options game, move on over to SSF and other futures. Every time you make a trade (and you can make as many as you want according to nothing but how much money is in your account) you can say "Screw you S.E.C.!" right out loud to your computer monitor. It feels good to say it! :)

    DIA SSF trades on OneChicago, QQQ SSF trades on NQLX. The links are in my signature.

    Difference between DIA and SPY is the difference between the DJIA and the S&P 500. Maybe we should start a new thread listing the actual stock compenents to compare Dow Jones' index to Standard & Poors'. They're similar enough though.
  8. FP,

    I understand your frustration, definitely not trying to bring you down. If you see strong enough opportunities in that timeframe, you've got something to work with. True, ES will liberate you from the pdt rule, but from my limited experience scoping out these opportunities, the leverage needed to trade ES with less than 25k is not to be taken lightly. If I understand correctly, you could wipe out in five minutes if the right chain of bad events happens.

    it seems odd to me that they would market SSFs based on etfs. the etf is already an abstraction of the index. an SSF of the etf is doubly removed. Do the etf SSFs tend to match the emini or full versions of these index futures?
  9. The SSF will match the underlying ETFs. The DIA SSF will match the DIA, the QQQ SSF will match the QQQ. Just a few cents wider spread.

    The added leverage of the SSF will keep you from being wiped out as quickly, if for instance you trade a SSF using 1:1 or 2:1 leverage in relation to your account size, it gives you a deeper cushion so you won't get a margin call as readily.

    Because of the added leverage of the E-minis, and the high price per share of the DIA and SPY, it actually costs about the same to trade a contract of DIA as a contract of ES.

    Anyone with a smaller account interested in getting introduced to the SSF or Futures world, might want to start smaller with a lower priced stock.

    AMD is one example of a stock you could trade SSF on, at the cost of about $150 to trade one contract, just to get a taste of SSF trading.
  10. tempting.....

    might look into this...

    where to start?
    #10     Apr 15, 2003