What is wrong with American companies.....let us/all count the ways...

Discussion in 'Economics' started by limitdown, Jan 20, 2011.

  1. What is wrong with American companies?,
    and their puppets and proxies in the media (CNBC, Fox Busniess New, etc.)?

    Why do these news stations, report their highly charged, slanted personal belief statements with such faux paus authority as if it were real or factual? Wasn't that what contributed / ran that delusional youth in Arizona into such sociopathic actions? Why do they keep allowing guests and others to espouse the notion that somehow America needs to cow-tow to the corporations, yet again on this very same matter?

    What is wrong with the American ideal and ethic in thinking that this or any other administration should lower or provide more corporate welfare through special tax breaks to incentivize them to repatriate their overseas profits that they have accumulated as a result of their business practices.

    Where is their sense of loyalty or obligation or duty or honor? Where is their sense of shared responsibility?, when the nation continues to shoulder the worlds' defense budget / expense, and provides a platform and reputation / credibility of being an American product produced by Americans, all of which they have not payed for but directly benefit from?

    Where is their sense of decency? Where is their sense of obligation to return what they have earned through their corporate tax obligation?, without some special break or otherwise?

    We are talking about a cumulative amount exceeding $4.3 trillion dollars (if not more) in free floating funds, all of which even at 20% or 35% tax rate to repatriate to the US would do wonders to achieve these objectives of these various groups, whether tea baggers, consevative extremists, or liberal extremists, or independent idealists.

    Such tax payments would go a long way to restore the full faith and credibility of the finances of the very same nation, country, system and institutions that provided the very shoulders of a giant from which they launched, maintained and succeeded from in their corporations.

    Such tax payments would not only reduce the deficit, restore the broken finances of a severely ailing nation, nation states, states, municipalities, school - health - local governments (fire, police, sanitation, social services) throughout the entire country.

    Such tax payments would reduce the deficit and ailing US Dollar relative to other currencies, particularly the Euro, Reminbi, Yen, Aussie Dollar, etc.

    Such tax payments would force the valuation of Crude down to its normal valuation of between $18 USD - $40 USD and do ten times more than its amount of payments, in good, towards fueling US domestic growth (through lower fuel costs).

    Such tax payments would almost instantly, through increase in stability of the finances of the US and its deficit and resultant increase in the US Dollar (through seeing a significant reduction in overal debt and devaluation in the eyes of the world) cause Crude to drop in relative US Dollars and price and cause the finances and deficits of the Metropolitan Transportation Systems (of every city throughout the US) to come back in balance, as they are such heavy consumers of diesel, gasoline and other fuel based products. These municipal systems have no choice but to continue to consume fuel at the current price and are constrained by their limitations of revenue through local fares and whatever they can take in through fare increases.

    Such tax payments would accomplish the much lauded objectives of these tea baggers, who extole their agenda but no means of accomplishing it.

    There are times when Economics overlap Politics and Tax Policy remains one of those largest overlapping discussions. Viewing this matter as it plays out in the media from a neutral perspective, hence an objective academic perspective leads one to these conclusions.

    Idealistic rantings of a delusional trader, you say? Not really, these are the same conclusions being reached by senior professors of finance and tax policy all across the nation (provided you attended one of the better B Schools).

    These are the same conclusions of the recent non-partisan or bi-partisan agenda recently released (http://www.fiscalcommission.gov/sites/fiscalcommission.gov/files/documents/CoChair_Draft.pdf). Page 3 of the presentation starts out with this lofty statement:

    Our Guiding Principles and Values
    • We have a patriotic duty to come together on a plan that will make America better off tomorrow than it is today
    • America cannot be great if we go broke.Our economy will not grow and our country will not be able to compete without a plan to get this crushing debt burden off our back.
      [*]Throughout our history, Americans have always been willing to sacrifice to make our nation stronger over the long haul. That’s the promise of America:to give our children and grandchildren a better life.
      [*]American families have spent the past 2 years making tough choices in their own lives. They expect us to do the same. The American people are counting on us to put politics aside, pull together not pull apart, and agree on a plan to live within our means and make America strong for the long haul.
  2. What? No financial transaction taxes? Or are you against FTT because you might have to pay it?

    I ask this question in all seriousness because every time I hear someone make the case for raising taxes, they talk about rasing other people's taxes and rarely their own.

  3. Repatriating foreign profits (earned offshore US) to the US, and paying the corporate taxes on those profits.

    These huge accumulated sums are being held hostage by the ...itchy witches (spelled with a capitalized bold B, in plural) continue to user their paramoures and surrogate mouthpieces in the financial press to stir up sympathy for some special corporate tax break or else they won't repatriate their profits.

    The discussions and pundits are all over and the sound bites as such are carefully sprinkled about, so as to whip up sentiments and public pressures. These discussions are also being held as demands upon the current administration as another suggested solution to their carefully arranged stranglehold on public discussions and demands to, of all things, improve the administration's standing in the eyes of the corporate sector. The very same sector that refused to hire hundreds of thousands of Americans and lift the economy up, just to embarass and harange the administration (both current and prior), whilest siting on record profits and having taken TARP funds just to stay in business and recover.

    How disingenuous!

    regarding your comment and response, I don't know where or how one would confuse that topic with the proposal to increase financial transaction taxes on trades.

    Hey, we have to help what is left of small businesses, namely traders (since they haven't sucessfully exported or offshored those jobs) and not raise the taxes on their struggling businesses. IOW, not in our backyard....
  4. Let's say you could get $1T of the $4.3T you say is out there. Current US debt is over $14T. I don't see a 7% reduction in our national debt solving our problems in any significant way.

    If you look at what's going on in other countries, they're all lowering their income tax rates. Even Norway and Sweden have cut their business tax rates to a maximum of 28%.

  5. (on a personal note -- use the reply button to post a comment instead of the quote button, which makes the thread artificially long winded)

    this is classic misdirection and off topic and not from an academic practical discussion on the merits of the thesis expounded on.

    this response is how worthless, directionless, political verbal bantering gets lost between good intentions and exhaustion.

    this thread as well as the quoted presentation of other neutral minded realists have already expressed the same fact of circumstances that continues to be ignored and subject to lobbyists and large corporate misdirection campaigns.

    Simply put if the corporations don't pay their existing taxes and repatriate their overseas profits then the same malaise that exists will continue instead of doing their moral and social obligation and part in contributing to the economy. In fact its in their own best and self interests. What continues to be put at risk are the sound state of the nation.

    When the nation needs what its due instead of continuing to be extorted by these very powerful corporate interests, and seeks to misdirect the discussion and obligation to pay their fare share, then you get responses and comments like yours.

    This is not a discussion about overall tax rates or changes to them in the long term.

    One can't continue to expect that things will improve with out their obligations being met. Public Policy MBA's understand that budgets to provide our standards of living and municipal debts require proper tax compliance without incentives.

    Public discussions regarding tying future spending approvals to revenue neutral or revenue positive adjustments in the budget. How in good conscience can these corporate welfare recipients not understand their obligation to play fair?

    (on another personal note - feel free to invest the time and research to start another thread on your topics, it will be worth reading)
  6. Sorry. I didn't realize that only Public Policy MBAs were capabe of understanding this topic. Next time I'll know better.

  7. BSAM


    ....."Where is their sense of loyalty or obligation or duty or honor?".....

    Exsqueeze me, but there is neither sense of nor reason for loyalty, obligation, duty, or honor to pay for the misadventures and whims of the thugs in the White House and Congress.

  8. and just like their surrogates financed behind the scenes and occupying most of the radical media business stories (of all persuasions) with their half baked tea bagger arguments

    all designed to avoid paying their fair share of taxes.

    The argument of accepting TARP but not feeling obligated to turn around and hire Americans with their recovery profits....

    The argument of privatizing wealth / profits and socializing losses is another spin on same discussion...

    The argument of expecting that this or the next administration will find some way of resolving some $14 trillion in US indenture (both outstanding and unfunded obligations not realized) is going to happen without all citizens (corporations especially) is another spin on this discussion....

    NO, one need not be an MBA in Public Policy just to participate,

    one only need stay on topic...

    it is simply amazing the notion of wanting to reduce and eliminate the debt but increase it through tax breaks for (of all entities) corporate welfare recipients....

    its amazing things have lasted as long as they have:
    1) the US taxpayer's ability to keep things afloat

    2) the value of the US Dollar (as bankrupt as we collectively are)

    3) the ability of states, municipalities and other local governments to pay their obligations on an ever decreasing tax base

    4) the willingness of foreigners to continue to purchase (with the expectation of the full faith of repayment) US debt going forward
  9. olias


    exactly. that's how any of us would feel in that situation. That's how the rich feel too. That's how the middle class feels too for that matter. That's how the poor feel when you talk about their money.
    #10     Jan 20, 2011