What is risk/reward knowing more than 90% of traders lose?

Discussion in 'Trading' started by emg, Sep 13, 2011.

  1. Eddiefl

    Eddiefl




    How is Bones, 60 minute chart, subjective.

    its 60min chart, where the big money plays, not the 5 min newbie play pool, shallow end of the kiddie pool.

    I think you have seen those setups many time before, and you havent pulled the trigger , right??

    EF
     
    #31     Sep 14, 2011
  2. Eddiefl

    Eddiefl


    You just fail, you just fail , period.

    Daytrading is high risk, low reward for most, but you say all traders fail. That is wrong, you never mention swing or position traders.

    You dont mention them, becuase your dumb ass saying doesnt work with them.

    You fail buddy. you got too much time on your hands looking for failure, you must be a champ in the bedroom with the ladies, with that great outlook.
    !!!
    EF
     
    #32     Sep 14, 2011
  3. :D

    Are you keeping a record of my posts or something...?

    I was being rhetorical... :p I know what an edge in a market is...

    Yeah trading is a negative sum game... to be fair, it is a lot like being a poker player. Only a few will make it. You have to be an "elite" at the game to make a living at it. It's not about luck, it's about having great gaming skills. If you're not a "great player" at anything you'll never make it in trading.

    No... I don't use TA to trade...

    I use complicated long term strategies based on yields. I used to be a very successful prop trader before this...

    Ever watch the movie Wall Street...? Remember the part where they're like "...it's in play..." Meaning a stock is ... well "in play..." really, that's probably the best way for newbies to succeed at day trading. Once a stock is in play... Jump on it...! :D Ignore anything else. Once a stock makes the news (even if you weren't ready for it) there's probably still a scalp left in it for you. There's always a knee jerk reaction of late entries into a stock. Sometimes stocks stay "in play" for days.

    I have a bunch of strategies that I don't use anymore...

    It is all about your gaming skills and making decisions. Don't expect a strategy to carry you to millions. It is all about how you interpret things at that time. You get it right... You're a winner...! You get it wrong... You're a loser...!

    To get rich you need to get it right a lot... And you need to win a lot...

    You have to be like a "champion boxer", "a bracelet winning/champion poker player" or whatever sport you want to compare it to.
     
    #33     Sep 14, 2011
  4. emg

    emg


    Best answer so far!
     
    #34     Sep 14, 2011
  5. there is no cure for the intraday black swans.what you accumulated during the whole week you could get back on friday.it`s a pointless and useless bull CACA,i`m telling ya!

    it happened to me a lot of times.sure you may not trade all day long and trade just certain set ups,but you have to sit and monitor for these set ups all day long anyway.i just found it useless fucking shit.
    i`d rather make 2-4 trades a month,but it ALWAYS be winners,all the time!It also happened to me when i started trading and back then the lowest timeframe i used was 4hours.The ratio was at least 90/10.Hell knows why i started this dayjerking bullshit!:confused:

    now,after 4 years of the headaches a have to get back to the simple things i started with.

    you definetley can make money daytrading,BUT there will be times when you give everything back,and you`ll have to start it over.

    you can try this ping-pong,but it`s just not for me anymore
     
    #35     Sep 14, 2011
  6. don`t even close to daytrading!box champ fights one-two fights in a year while daytrader has to fight every minute!:D :D
     
    #36     Sep 14, 2011
  7. Well, there is some really GOOD insight here.... and there's also a lot of BS as well!

    To answer the question directly... it's rather SIMPLE!!

    Q: What is risk/reward knowing more than 90% of traders lose?
    A: Simply plan to be on the side that has 10% winners!!
    ( Let's face it, there's MORE room on that side of the fence! )

    Seriously, don't laugh, just analyze what I said.... "PLAN" to be with the winners!!

    What does it mean?
    1) Well, right away... YOU NEED to... PLAN! (most won't & don't)
    2) It also means.. take a look @ what the 90% are doing, and... DON'T DO WHAT THEY DO!!
    That's right, whatever the losers are doing... just DON'T DO THAT!!

    Beyond that... open a small account somewhere... use it to SIM-trade... you'll learn THAT particular piece of software inside & out... PLUS, you'll get lot's & lot's & lot's of screen time!... virtually, FREE!
    (remember... you won't be REALLY TRADING... so you won't REALLY BE LOOSING! Already, you can say you're doing better than 90% or more at this stage of the game!)

    If it's fair to say that you'll probably BLOW-OUT your 1st trading account... then spend that amount of money on EDUCATIONAL MATERIALS!
    (do the research, you'll figure it out!)

    IF you're fortunate enough to find a MENTOR that is:
    a) successful
    b) has the ability to teach, as well as something worth teaching, and
    c) willing to teach/put up with you for that amount of time!!
    WORSHIP THE GROUND THEY WALK!
    plus, thank your lucky stars... because, you are TRULY blessed!


    PLAN to spend years doing this.... and when you finally start figuring it out....
    1) you'll still be around!
    2) you should be pretty well educated!
    3) you should know your software, inside & out!
    4) you should have ample amount of screen time!
    5) you should have confidence in your decision process by now!
    6) you'll know if YOU REALLY LIKE THIS LIFE! (it's not all glam!)
    7) you've SURVIVED long enough to almost say... "I've seen it all..."
    8) BUT, most important... YOU'LL STILL HAVE ENOUGH MONEY LEFT OVER to actually put all YOUR YEARS OF HARD WORK to good use!!
    (should have made a Letterman TOP-10 List!)

    And don't think for a moment that it won't be YEARS of HARD WORK & LONG HOURS in front of your PC or reading books/magazines/manuals!!

    Have FUN, Enjoy the TRIP.... if you survive, the JOURNEY is excellent!!

    Happy Trading,
    TraderJMB


    Here's a couple tips of MY wisdom, that TOOK ME, way too long to FINALLY figure out...
    1) this game is literally 90% psychological (think HERD mentality, and use it to your advantage!)
    2) the trend REALLY IS your friend!
    3) treat your STOPS like the "seat-belt" in a car... "you don't really want its protection on every trip you take... BUT, when things go wrong... YOU'RE SURE GLAD IT WAS THERE!"
    ... in other words, put it where you DON'T think the market will go... AND DO NOT MOVE IT... EVER!! (except to tighten)
    4) assume that every trade you make, WILL BE A LOSER!! IF, you can't stand the pain of that... TRADE SMALLER!!

    Last, and certainly not least... MY PERSONAL most valuable piece of wisdom... FIND a "trading group", not too big (10-20 or so) of like minded traders... get to know & trust each other.... meet up 2-4 times a month, talk, share, learn!! Between that many people... YOU'LL ALL HAVE SOMETHING THAT YOU CAN TEACH, THE REST!! Not to mention sharing BOOKS & EDUCATIONAL MATERIALS... It's FUN, you make GREAT FRIENDS... and you'll save a TON OF TIME & MONEY!! (I personally couldn't find this... so, in 1995, I started the "Los Angeles Futures Support Group." Let me say this, to you... of the 13 founding members on day-one, NINE of us were still there 8-years later! And to this day, I see & speak to most of these guys on a regular basis.... AND ALL OF THEM, are some of my VERY BEST FRIENDS!!

    THANK YOU.... Jack, Gunter, Bill, Mark, Steve, Larry, Ben, Ken H., Ken B., Kim, Chris, Mike & Phil and the dozens of others that came & went over those many years together!
    ... I OWE YOU GUYS, EVERYTHING!! MUCHO LOVE!!... :D :D :D
     
    #37     Sep 16, 2011
    K-Pia likes this.


  8. I'm only going to comment on this part of your post...

    The problem is that newbies don't know what the winners are doing. That is why it is pointless in my opinion to start trading for yourself unless you've first done that working for a firm. Even then most traders who work at firms and have access to lots of teaching resources wash out.

    The risk/reward question is a good one. Risk and reward don't mean anything if you get every trade wrong... R/R just keeps you in the game longer but it doesn't make you a winner.

    Let say your R/R is 3:1....

    Most will say... "No big deal...! If I lose 3 in a row I'll just need 1 winner to get even!..." Except... there is nothing to say that you won't lose 3 in a row... get a winner... then lose 4 in a row... Then win 1 and again lose 3 in a row etc... Now add in commissions and you will see that you will quickly fall way behind.

    I think everyone gets the point. It is really important to get things right and not lose. If don't have a way to do that then you shouldn't trade. At least that's my opinion on the matter.
     
    #38     Sep 16, 2011
    K-Pia likes this.
  9. I think alot of it has to do with people thinking they can make money everyday using the same strategy.

    The markets change, and as a result, some strategies work better in different environments. People need to learn to NOT trade, rather than overtrade when conditions arent right.

    But many dont think like that, they have some notion they can print money daily.
     
    #39     Sep 16, 2011
  10. tim888

    tim888

    It more has to do with capitalization and position risk as a function of market volatility and of commissions paid. Most people don't realize than even if they have a small trading edge they can face risk of ruin due to high commissions if they trade more often than they should. This is a good article on this subject.
     
    #40     Sep 18, 2011