even more staggering are the accomplishments of people who didn't bother to graduate (or even attend) college and/or high school. some of them started universities, whose graduates think that anyone who doesn't attend them is a nonperson. some of them founded corporations, which today wouldn't dream of hiring someone whose resume looks like the founder's. hypocrisy is so insidious -- and ironic! I recall meeting one of the gurus of trading software who told me he had no intention of sending his children to college. Later he said he would only hire college graduates to work for him. Poor thing. He wasn't even aware of the contradiction. Or perhaps he felt like college grads made good slaves... Chisox, anyone who tells you you need a degree to accomplish anything meaningful is full of crap. He has too much invested in his pedigree to say otherwise. Education can be had in many more interesting ways. I can remember learning one meaningful thing in college (before I left), as against a whole boatload of poorly supported presumptions that paralyzed my thinking for years. Now, before certain people jump to the opposite conclusion, I am not saying that having a degree is necesarily a ticket to mediocrity. In the right hands, any education is marvelous. And that's what it's all about. The right hands. In the wrong hands, even the best education is a waste (actually, it's impossible). We live in an establishment that rewards the degreed, especially those of certain institutions. But the trading profession ought to point out the fallacy of the notion that formal education is the only education that matters. The markets are the great equalizers, the demolishers of such prejudice. I respect anyone who gets himself through college. It's an accomplishment that deserves it. As for the Ivy Leaguer's, it must be nice to max out your SAT's. But I am a bit bothered by any attitude of superiority that might come along with it.
HI ALL Theres so much "shit" floating around here at Elite Trader i'm gonna start wearing my galoshes.. Hehe The other day a poster "M22AU" declared he made a ton of money shorting PEOP. At the time the stocks price was 15 cents. If your gonna talk shit, at least get your story straight. Makes for great entertainment..... Sterling
This is truly the most right on post I have read here (unless I REALLY want to be self indulgent and exclude my own ) I mentioned they took me (an Ivy League school)...but that was as a grad student, and I just sort of backed into it...a long story. But I never finished those studies...I just get to say I went. My son goes to a state school. He is on a scholarship, but if he weren't, the tuition is $1200 a year. My daughter is at Northwestern. MAJOR bone of contention between my wife and I. To me, it is an indulgence that really has little or no value. She wants to be a journalist, so that means grad school. Hope there is some money left for that. And when she finishes grad school, and gets a job as a cub reporter, or newscaster, or whatever in some 5th tier market like Bumf*ck North Dakota do I think they are going to ask or care where she went as an undergrad? Hell, I don't know why I am making this response. It is so off the subject of trading. But I am crazed that I feel I am unnecessarily pissing away 40k a year for the "prestige" of a name brand university. My son, who is at U of Florida is going to get just as good an education for free. You get out of college what you put in. Sorry for this rant. But it struck a nerve with me. The economy sucks, my income is down, my expenses are up, the market is tough for us all. So VULTURE, I owe you for setting things straight. But hell, why did you have to strike this nerve and get me wound up? I should not submit this post. But I guess I will push the button, because like you, I am offended when I hear that a trader thinks their Ivy League backround makes them more qualified. Know what I studied? Mass communications. Yeah, really paid off in my trading career. NOT!!! Hell, I didn't even know what the stock market was when I was in college. (ok, maybe I did have some vague idea, but I certainly had no interest in it) I don't mean to berate a superior education. But anyone who thinks that an Ivy League education is going to be of any benefit to a trader (not a fund manager.....I mean guys like us) is badly misled at best. I would feel more confident if I needed surgery and my doctor went to Harved Med. If I was in deep legal trouble, I would probably want a Yale lawyer... but if I were to start a trading firm, I would go to a poker room and look to recruit the strongest players. I can't think of any better place to start. At the risk of repeating myself, the best qualities for a trader (other than experience) are attitude, discipline, and the ability to get a good read on your opponents. To adapt to your adversaries. And believe me, the market is an adversary. The specialists in particular are adversaries that will deal from the bottom of the deck whenever they get the chance. I don't think they teach stuff like this at those eight schools. They don't even have good enough sports teams to interest anyone in looking for an edge in the spreads. Well at least not since the days of Bill Bradley. And old as I am, he was before even my time! Did love him on the Knicks though Again, sorry for the rant. I promise to be a good boy and never do this again
interesting self revelation. got a chuckle out of it. my problem with college is that I had no sense going in, so I believed everything they told me. It took years to undo that, but I suppose it's not their fault that I didn't have the sense to sort out the crap from the useful material. And what with all those pretty girls running around, it was hard to concentrate anyway. If you're gifted enough with the intellect and circumstances to get through a top school, I hope you see those components to your good fortune that were out of your control. If you were the kind of person who worked hard too, you already know what I'm talking about.
I agree with everything you guys said. Eitherway, i cant win. i guess you resent ivy leaguers like you resent people who have bmws. some things will never change.
Not resentment....just some things don't translate. Not many things have more value than an Ivy League education. My contention was just that there doesn't seem to be any correlation between an Ivy League degree, and successful trading. Other aspects of finance.....a whole different story. Investment Banking? Finacial Analyst? Accounting? Hey, the Ivy League degree will not only open doors for you, but you WILL be qualified in your field. But day trading? Give me a good bookmaker or poker player. It is a mentality and an art, not a book learned science. Also we were talking about the economic realities of an expensive education in todays environment. I am actually glad my daughter is at Northwestern. I am very proud she got in. I just think it is an extravagance given that she will need to go to grad school afterwards to pursue her goals. And since she wants to be a journalist, well ideally she should go to grad school at Columbia (oh...an Ivy League school). But budgetary constraints are a reality. She could have gone to UF for free, and still have gone to grad school at Columbia. And in the end, she would have the same credentials. Hey, sorry if I need SOMETHING to bitch about. I did appologize already. I won't complain any more. But I will appologize again if I offended anyone's sensibilities. Sorry to all...especially Treykool. (wow...an ivy league super trader who can make numbers dance like Einstien and is gifted with an obvious talent for the romance languages...vous est TRES formidable mon ami....au revoir)