Slapshot: Thank you for mentioning your success. Just remember that the success you experience is all due to you. I can point in a direction, but implementing a trading plan/strategy is very personal. One guy can make an idea work...another will simply botch it. So good for you, I'm glad you're experiencing some success in a challenging business. You know, when I first showed up here I wasn't looking at intraday charts at all. But all of you guys got me started looking. For a while I watched the 1 minute chart...and decided to try fading the chart. It was working pretty well too...until one day they got me. LOL. I still have a tendency to focus more on the daily chart...and rely on other types of indicators to guide my intraday trading. But I now seem to have settled on at least watching a 5 minute chart. It seems to add some value at times...and in that regard it's one more avenue to look for clues as to the next move. I think the longer the chart, the more apt you are to see the big moves developing. Of course, to ride the bigger moves is going to require a bigger risk tolerance than some here seem willing to take on. It's rather amazing though how simple the market can be at times when you allow the market to work for you, as opposed to making this constant effort to make a point or two out of a 1 minute chart. OldTrader
I suppose one man's "squiggles" might be another's key indicator. To each his own. But some of the comments here remind me of grandpa bitching because everyone knows the only way to hunt squirrel is with a musket and not with them new fangled rifles with bullets! They got all them extra doo dads on them that make no sense and just distract you.
Thanks for the help nohkio, As you know I am not very swift on the way to get info into the chat properly. Regarding your three paragraphs in the order you presented them My personal policy is to give away any settings I use for anything, any software that is provided to me as a courtesy of others and all maths (like the seven basic equations for anticipation and the 7 through 0 scoring using the P, V relation and the addition of the third variable A/D. The MACD setting are 5, 13, 6 three stochastic settings are: 5, 2, 3, 14, 1 ,2 and 14, 1, 3. PP 2. The purpose I have for posting three is to help beginners get through tripling their initial capital on ES in a matter of several weeks trading only fast paced markets. My objective is to use almost nothing to make a lot of money by some standards. I ask that they tape out the space between 20 and 80 completely so they can only see when the market is fast paced and they cannot see the signals that do not matter intially until a person is optimizing capital on a time based velocity profit/ unit time). Use only the 14, 1, 3 taped until you have made three times your initial capital. Watch price and watch volume. Watch the MACD. The major thing you first learn is the entry and exit. When you see both lines, then you enter (long or short as the case may be.) When the lines disappear you exit the trade. On Friday there were four trades for a toal of 45 units. A unit on the emini for ES is about fifty bucks. A beginner will do about 50% of that for reasons of not following directions mostly. 22 times 50 bucks is enough for one day. That is a good portion of the capital needed for margin. I also have the people practice keeping a log for stops. Make a list from the market formations and C&R every 5 to15 min using the listing two entries behind your last listing. This is to keep people's eyes peeled. PP3 This is all done on the trading fractal. For ES the fractal is 5 min and you anticipate on the 1 min. The list of stops gathered on the 1 min is the most effective for making money. It alone will double your inital results. What I mean is that it drives you from only 22 points toward 45 points. You are gaining an even more valuable thing as well. You are in the market longer and operating nearer a beginner's optimum. PP4. this is a very important consideration. we all know there are two basic types of indicators: relative and absolute. designers, by intention or otherwise choose one or the other. here we have an absolute and a relative indicator. It is Obvious how the differences play out as they diffrentiate market pace, volatility and so on. Were I to use an absolute indicator for training a beginner to make money I would spec out the absolute value ranges that depict the fast pace, the only pace beginners should use. With stochastics, as a relative indicator you have to tune the defaults to various settings to optimize money making. This set up is a simple one which rapidly trains a person in relatiavistic indicators by simply using three. I am not really getting into making money with beginners what I am doing is getting their NLP straightened out and seeing to it that they are not stuck in any place mentally. From beginer to getting to making money efficiently their are about eight levels to go through. You definitely get to a KISS operation after you get past all the places where you get stuck. It's a very good idea to take out your original capital after you triple your money. when your commissions per week equal your asalary it's time to have an annual fee contract and consider not being employed any more.
Don't "bash" my Hero! LOL but please get the facts straight. Careful re-reading of the last several posts will confirm that nowhere does Oldtrader say not to use indicators nor is he bitching about any one else using them. But plenty of people will assault him for pointing out the limitations of indicators. He simply points out that indicators (which are LAGGING) only tell a person what has already happened and suggests that more focus on macro-view and price action instead of indicator overload might be helpful. Taken within the context of the thread, these comments are true, since it is a thread about price action trading.
Less is more indicatorwise. I feel that the sequence of signals from a minimalistic system is the definition of KISS. Truly a sequence gives you successive branch points where possibilities are eliminated in succession thus allowing you to focus on the upcoming critcal event. It is like the slow motion of two lovers crossing to each other in a flower filled field. they never smash into each other but just do the right thing at the right time. I will comment next on a screw up regarding "oversold" to show you the sequencing elements.
Let's see.... let me get this straight.... if I trade by price action alone, as defined by the patterns in Edwards and Magee, and to not use indicators to "reinforce" my decision, I am saying that I like being stuck in a place. The presumption must be that indicator usage results in improved timing. If this presumption is true, then hershey's statement is true. However, if timing is not improved with the use of indicators to reinforce decsions made using price action alone, then for that trader, hershey's claim does not hold true.
Geez Chill out. We all have our favorite systems or what works for us. btw ALL indicators are LAGGING. Therefore timing using any indicator is lagging. Learned that few years back. A hard lesson. I was into stoch then. Have realized price/volume action and s/r is the answer for me. Keep it simple as we say at ttrader ) mktsurf
Lobster, You just draw a line and say, "If prices hold here and reverse That's bullish, but if they break down through this line that's bearish." And you trade accordingly. S/R doesn't measure anything but the strength of the markets memory. When the market is able to forgive the past, then we are free to move on to the next point of contention.
thanks for the reply... could what you are saying in many paragraphs... be described with the term: "stochastic pop" ? Just asking. Ice
SOME OF YOU PEOPLE ARE GOD DAMN UNBELIEVABLE! (this is NOT directed at you, Jack) The #1 most ANNOYING phenomenon on ET is when someone opens up and tries to teach, AND THEN PEOPLE COMPLAIN AND TELL THEM TO "CHILL OUT!" UNREAL!!!!!!!!! Asking questions is FINE, but to hint that they should stop/slow down is one of the DUMBEST things you could possibly do! Are we here to learn or not?! JACK, I find your posts very interesting and you should continue. There is one very important thing you need to learn about ET: IGNORE negative posts! Just do your thing and don't waste your time with negative responses! Please continue posting as much as you want. I'm sure others want you to continue, too. OldTrader, glad to see you back posting again. I think both OT and Jack make interesting points and it's cool to see some veterans stating their opinions and debating them. I'm glad you're BOTH here. GG