traders who have failed but

Discussion in 'Trading' started by terrible, May 30, 2004.

  1. terrible


    cant get themselves to give up. I know a lot of people say that many profitable traders need 5-6 years of experience before they can turn a profit but how about the wasted opportunity? even if you work a gas station job you'll likely take home 10 k per year thus 6 years equals 60k worth of income wasted away.

    furthermore, many traders are likely to lose in the first few years so who knows how much ground one has to make in losses and lost income before trading become a logical job in monetary terms.

    are any of you in that predicament? i'm thinking about trading but i've always known that you need only one bad loss to take away 20 profitable ones. in an environment where if you can be right 20 out of 21 times yet still lose obviously very few people can make it over the true long term.

    so how many years will you guys give yourselves before you face reality if your in that predicament
  2. I think that if 1 loss can wipe out 20 winners then you need to work on your money management and risk parameters.

    I have herd on this board that it does take 4-6 years to make it as a trader, but it also takes several years to make it at anything beyond flipping burgers. I was also once told by a natural gas trader I ran into that in gerneral if you can make it past your first 2 years your chances are vastly improved. I am commited to tking as long as it takes. I think that unless you have that mind set you will eventaully fail. I think that it is an all or nothing proposition.

    For a little perspective on where I am coming from:
    While I hold a full time job I have been trading live for 9 months now with the past 5 being profitable to the extent that if I had more capital I could make a nice living. The first 4 months were pretty much me making as many mistakes as possible, it was pretty rough and I almost wiped out. I still make several mistakes that are sometimes costly (I generally learn on the first time or sometimes 2) but I have never put myself in a position to have one trade wipe out the results from 20 sine I have turned net profitable. Unless I am taking profits early it takes more than one bad trade to erase the gains from one trade.
  3. terrible


    yes i agree with you that you need to put in time in order to achieve something more in life. ie a degree. however, a degree is much more of a safe play than taking on trading.

    i only wonder if people can become good traders over the long term. money is harder to make over bear markets than super bull markets.
  4. It may be possible to think this problem through is a much different way.

    Almost all people who set out to make money neglect to think the process through.

    There are many ways to make money.

    For each of those ways the paths to get there are various also.

    I strongly recommend not taking any paths that have front ends where money is lost to any extent. By that I mean losing either frequently or unexpectedly.

    These two classes of losses are unnecessary and unproductive.

    Another major consideration is the selection process for which ways you will be making money. Many of the money sucessful making possibilities have upper limits. It is a good idea to not consider such limited methods and approaches.

    Both posters above seem to be heavily tied to the myths that abound in the financial industry. The people who abide by this kind of stuff are not that kind of people you want to associate with vis a vis making money. It is very important to get all the myths off the table as soon as possible.

    Maybe it would be a good idea to get a 100 3x5 cards for each of 6 to 8 colors. Make the colors stand for facets of making money. Fill on the 800 cards with stuff you know. From the bunch you have, winnow out the best subset for getting the problem you have now turned into an opportunity that is unlimited.
  5. Learner


    Should we make a poll to ask all the readers to see how years is an average for a full-time novice to become a profitable trader?:confused:
  6. MrDinky


    Is it, though? Lot of BA's and MBA's having trouble finding work or working entry level jobs that barely cover the student loan payments. I don't think I'm talking a small percentage here either.

  7. Cheese


    The idea of trading for a living is almost an invitation to failure. The markets are always chopping up and spitting out all-comers who want to trade to live. I welcome them and the liquidity they add to the market.

    The thing is the market (ie index futures and in particular this could be the DOW) delivers very efficiently the opportunity to enrich yourself. Few exploit that opportunity. Few seem to understand that. But thats the tack.

    There are no barriers. Start with very small capital. Dedicate yourself full time over the short-term. This requires devotion. You have to know your market. Therefore you have to study relentlessly. You have analyze. It is a sustained act of love of your quest.

    Once you have got the correct trading model only then can you start on your way.
  8. bobcathy1

    bobcathy1 Guest

    I have talked to a lot of successful traders and we all have the same thing in common........we all have lost a lot of money before we find our way to making money. Several times!

    The biggest thing that undermines on line traders is lack of in your undies has drawbacks. You need to approach this like a business. Be prepared for the game. Set your rules and follow them.

    Last week for me was a total wash out....but the weeks before made plenty of money. No system will make money all the time. A required skill is being a gracious loser. Emotional basket cases will never make it trading.

    For emotional people and people with PMS.....this means not trading during stressful days. You know when they are, mark them on the calendar and DO SOMETHING ELSE.......:)

    And the market always chops. No doubt about it. You need a strategy that will perform for you under these conditions.:D