Just for the record, I am not RealTrader, and I don't do aliases. I have almost 10K posts here, I don't have a need to use other handles. That being said, it is nice to see others didn't drink the TST coolaid either. This is the laughable, "don't lose your money to the markets fast, when you can lose it to TST slow" argument. The fallacy of such argument is TIME. A trader wasting his time by doing Combines might not lose much money, but by pursuing an unachievable dream he loses valuable TIME. And money can be gained, but time can not. And mind you there is no guarantee that he will ever learn anything that makes him more profitable. Show us the customers' yachts! I don't like to get personal, but since it seems you are the current knight in shining armour for TST, might I ask you: 1. How does it feel not to be able to pass the Combine after repeated tries with a 3 decade long trading experience and being profitable with real money? You know what? You don't have to answer this.... 2. What does the above facts (you profitable trader repeatedly failing the combine) tell to newbies about their chances? Why should they even try? 3. Wouldn't you agree that if a profitable trader with your experience can't make it, then maybe, just maybe the Combine rules are unnecessary too hard? You already agreed with me about the BS nature of the 55% rule... I hope you noticed that me being personal still stayed on topic... So don't get personal with me unless you can keep it TST related. And just to answer your incoming question, TST came here recruiting and before I go for a job interview I like to do due diligence on the company... So far TST has been found too light....
Everything I ever posted in this thread was TST related. First of all, I never inferred the other guy was you specifically. There have been numerous negative posters in this thread over time. Odds of probability are that someone with only 5 posts and all of them negative in one thread is someone who was there before. Secondly, I am on record many, many times stating the old combine parameters were a high bar to pass. Now that the time limit of performance is nixed, the bar is lowered. One must still be able to aptly trade today's modern markets or nothing else matters at all. If one can aptly trade today's modern markets, TST may offer one a chance at outside funding if desired. Lastly, I don't care what TST does other than the potential funding side for all traders alike. I don't care what any other educational services do, and I don't care to discuss, debate, argue or berate anything to do with anything trading-related any more. So you & others can preserve your opinions which no one can change anyways. I came here out of boredom to offer potentially helpful input. Even though times change, this is still the ET of old and nobody ever has meaningful conversations that result in any active posters changing their minds. Which therefore begs the question, why even bother posting in the first place? ciao
-TST is taking advantage of Novice traders and is lying about their "professional" education. That is confirmed with proof we agreed on that. -You said you couldn't care less about their education all you care about is the funding program. That is fantastic, we agreed on that. That is the only thing you should be concerned about as a trader. That is the end of the conversation. I came out here not with an opinion but with claims and supporting evidence backing those claims up. That is why our conversation has been a success. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Pekelo has come here and it looks that you two have had futile debates without stating your claims and evidence evidently, and challenging it directly with evidence, and have just been going back and forth at each other aimlessly. Whatever the deal was I will outline the claims made by Pekelo here clearly Pekelo is complaining about the combine. The combines objective is to give you an opportunity to become funded and trade live with "investors money" in order to make money from trading for yourself. (close enough) By him complaining about it, that means he claims the objective of the combine may have a fallacy and may not be as it seems. Pekelo has committed himself to the "Combine Objective" outlined above: (to become funded and trade live with "investors money" in order to make money from trading for yourself) Therefore, simply, he has noticed something fishy with the combine. I mean this man has committed himself and now he is sharing his wisdom, that is why most who HAVE given a year of their time and $1,200 worth of cash to this program notice something fishy. Then as they challenge it they are disregarded as losing traders, since trading is a tough game. Since that may be inaccurate and misleading they feel they are being lied to and treated unfairly. Then the arguments heat up and continue Those people who HAVE NOT committed themselves to the combine objective can come here and easily tell these people they are just mad and dumb. In order to understand ones pain, the other has to experience the same pain, and even then they may still not understand each other. It's like an overweight man has given his all to lose weight by following a special diet or program, and then his other overweight buddies who have not taken any steps and have no will to lose fat just laugh and make fun of him. please this is not aimed at anybody, it just something to think about. --------------------------------------------------------------------- HENCE, we need to dissect the combine as best we can. 1) Can other VERIFIED PROFITABLE traders get funded with the given combine rules. If you check out all of the trader interviews of traders who have been VERIFIED on profitly on this link HERE(youtube channel): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tu9sVt0cQYE&list=PLHwh3-YF4uakkwueWSEq9Vxlq4K8YiC0y&index=3 You will see there is no way that their trading style will fit in with the combine rules. Just as it was difficult for me since I hold trades for 1-2 days and rarely are they day trades. I only know one VERIFIED profitable scalper and that is Vad from my last last post. 2) So ok, who cares about other profitable traders, since those trades are different, right, lets move on. That doesn't hold much wait. Now let's test the intentions of the combine by breaking everything down in detail a) WHO created the combine? Michael Patak CEO of TST b) WHO is Michael Patak (as a trader)? He was a profitable pit trader JUST like his employees/friends 1)Eddie Horn(who is a failed screen trader) 2) John Hoagland(who is also a failed screen trader) so does Michael has Proof that he is a profitable screen trader? or is he JUST like his pit trader friends, a failed screen trader? where are the odds? So a failed screen trader creates a metric for the combine for other screen traders. Now that we identified who he might be, let's dig down to find the intentions of the company itself and see if it will lead us to some clues for the intentions of the combine c) WHY did he create this company and the combine? If you do research on pit traders, as almost all fail to transition form pit trading to screen trading, they join or create other business. You will see pit traders (failed screen traders) marked as professionals because of their 25 year "pit trading experience"., just like at TST and everywhere else They will work for BROKERAGES in different positions, they will work for FINANCIAL MEDIA in different positions, they will create their own EDUCATIONAL trading businesses for screen traders, and will create any other trading related business venture to survive. Therefore, the creation of this company seems to point in this direction as well (high probability) And hence the combine has a different purpose as well Why am I so good at this? Because I am a STOCK trader and I SPECIALIZE in penny stocks, small cap market. Hence I am good at identifying company information, their intentions and putting puzzles together. However, my friends, please do not argue. Simply challenge this information I have provided with Evidence of your own, that's it, nothing more. We seek the truth. We do not seek dominance to be right on an internet forum. Thank You
1. Maybe so, but why aren't you dealing with his arguments? He had plenty of valid points. 2. We are in agreement here, I don't care about their educational side. But when I ask myself, would I approach the recruitment like they do, the answer is a huge no. So because of the huge discrepancies between really trying to find good traders and their silly rules, something has to give. 3. I agree canned options are the best, because they can last forever. Now if we would hold back criticism this thread would be just a BMT-like circlejerk. Who wants that? 4. Bullshit, I change my option all the time IF someone comes up with facts or a good argument. But it is a very tall IF, and the moment TST will drop the silly metrics and people making at least middle 5 figures start to post here, I will be a fan of the company. Until then we will just educate the naive... 5. So am I brother, so am I. See we agree on more things than disagree. 6. I already preempted this question in my previous post because I knew it was coming. By the way I found at least 2 posters on BMT who said although they are profitable with their own money, but they couldn't pass the Combine. So what does it tell us about TST's approach to recruiting? That it sucks, plain and simple... Anyhow, I will go back to enjoying the summer, after all life is more than just watching screens...
Austin, Pekelo has already admitted he "paid" for a combine and failed. He's bitter. You are not going to be able to temper him. He also lied about the alias thing, he HAS been caught with another alias on here. This bullshit argument from realtrader is a joke about whether the TST founders are profitable screen traders. Anyone here know who Ben Lichenstein is? He is "the" guy that does the s&p squawk and has been for years. He blew out many years ago but actually found his calling and almost everyone in Chicago would agree the guy is solid. Nobody cares he blew out. Don Bright couldn't trade his way out of a brown paper bag, does that mean Bright Trading is a scam? There are two essential questions that are important here. 1) Does TST honor their contracts? So far, not one person has claimed otherwise. This is very important for any business. If TST violated their contract I would be the first on here to crucify them. 2) The second question is not related to TST directly but rather to the trader...does the trader have an edge? Very simple question. If they don't, you can get rid of all rules and all metrics, it will not matter. Success is not possible. If they do have an edge, no amount of rules or metrics will stop them. Those are the two questions. The problem with the complainers here is that losers in life never take ownership of their failures. They blame everyone but themselves. On this thread, it's TST. But spend a few minutes and take a walk around other ET threads and you will see what I mean. FX threads: you can't make a dime because bucket shops run your stops. Equity threads: those damn HFT firms won't let me make money because they jump in front of my orders. Option threads: damn market makers are manipulating prices Futures threads: damn Fed killed volatility, no one can make a dime in this market And round and round we go. The pattern is always the same. Blame everyone but yourself. Blame your wife, your kids, your dog, your broker, the government, the SEC, NFA, hedge funds, HFT firms, the neighbors, the weather, the middle east, blah blah blah. Not once, not once will these people ever look at themselves in the mirror and admit it's THEM.
"This bullshit argument from realtrader is a joke about whether the TST founders are profitable screen traders. Anyone here know who Ben Lichenstein is? He is "the" guy that does the s&p squawk and has been for years. He blew out many years ago but actually found his calling and almost everyone in Chicago would agree the guy is solid. Nobody cares he blew out." How is this argument "bullshit"? Have you DISPROVED IT with EVIDENCE? You have just admitted that I am correct and those guys at TST are all FAILED SCREEN TRADRERS. However, you are saying that it doesn't matter that they are failed screen traders, as many people absolutely love them and love listening to them ? which people? 90% of the novice losing traders who they trap like yourself my friend? I do this business to MAKE MONEY and I am NOT in this business to ENJOY it, have FUN with it, or gain VALUE for my dollar. I am not here to gain VALUE for my dollar. I am here to GAIN MORE MONEY for MY MONEY which is what trading is about. I understand. I have seen another TST thread on a dictatorship forum called BMT. Big Mike owns the forum and partners with various marketers and educators and then advertises/markets them. And you work for him and support them with misleading evidence. I understand, so there is no way to win an argument with a person who ignores PROVEN statements and make his own FALSIFIED information. When TST was slightly challenged on the BMT forum Big Mike stepped in and said the EXACT same thing. he said hey guys I like TST, it doesn't matter if you end up being a PROFITABLE trader, it doesn't matter if you MAKE MONEY with their program. What MATTERS is that you gain VALUE. With TST you gain DISCIPLINE from their combine, you gain KNOWLEDGE, and you gain EDUCATION, a FANTASTIC tradin experience AND If you get funded TST will keep their contract since they are a legit company, HOWEVER, you WILL NOT MAKE MONEY, but who cares right? you gain that value for your money. So you can stick your FAKE PROFESSIONAL FAILED SCREEN TRADERS up your butt together with your FANTASTIC VALUE and FANTASTIC FUNDING. I am here to MAKE MONEY How can you Disprove my claims that 1) The creators of TST are ALL FAILED SCREEN TRADERS 2)The creators of TST are like all the OTHER failed screen traders that created this company to make money from others in order to survive By IGNORING THEM, saying THIS DOESN'T MATTER, and ACCUSING me of OTHER IRREVERENT MISLEADING BOGUS ? It looks like the FAILED SCREEN TRADERS(creators of TST) had no Screen trading edge as they had in the pits, so they decided to create this company to make their money the easy way. After all, although they have no idea what a VERIFIED TRACK RECORD is and an actual PROFESSIONAL TRADER is, they will call everyone else who goes against their company a loser just like them and say if you had an edge you would of had it. Do you know how trading works? you make money consistently with the probabilities week after week, month after month. You don't get an edge that is 100% right on every trade by training your "screen trading super skills in the combine and through Hoag's failed screen trader classes" and then you could rule the world. In the market you have to identify opportunities and take advantage of them as they come What you are saying is: go in front of a slot machine (where the odds are against you) and play. If you are not good enough keep practicing, do push-up, get better" If you can't do it you are an idiot. I gave you examples of PROFITABLE VERIFIED TRADERS. who trade for a living. Can you give me PROFITABLE VERIFIED TRADERS who trade for a living in the company? the creators of the combine? How can losers create a prop firm? THEY CAN'T that's why ITS NOT a prop firm, they say so themselves. They WON'T LAST if they opened a prop firm because their traders WILL not sustain their business. and because they are UNPROFITABLE themselves. The only thing they can do is a create a CASINO and TRAP traders with LIES. Don't blame the odds on the casino blame it on yourself. This is about ODDS my friend, just like trading, you should get college educated on statistics and probabilities. If you want to be a marketer and help a company through falsely accusing everyone and providing false information you have to do much better than that.
Real Trader, you need to get on some prozac. You have more then a few screws loose. I have no desire to debate this with you as you present no facts. While I have no idea if they are profitable or not, neither do you. But the burden is on the accuser, not the defender. You just come on here and scream and shout with zero facts. You babble on about things that have nothing to do with this thread. Please seek psychiatric help.
1) who cares if it's Ben Lichenstein or some clown on CNBC that everyone likes. We are not talking about who likes a clown who talks about trading and can't trade for his life that everyone is entertained by. we are talking about how you can't learn to trade from some one who is not a trader ( a marketer, liar, or educator) and how someone who is not a profitable screen trader cannot set combine metrics for other screen traders to DEVELOP off or get FUNDED on. 2) do you know what Bright Tradkng is? Bright trading is a prop firm. That means if I am liscenced I can trade trough them like a broker in order to gain leverage/buying power. In my experience props also sometimes have great borrows on stocks when compared to trading through a public broker. The CEO of bright trading doesnt know shit about profitable screen trading, Hence, he does not set restrictions/metrics on other screen traders' accounts. What they do do is manage their risk just like any other Brokerage or Prop firm. they also increase size or force you to increase size (depends on firm) and have other stuff like that. Basicaly you, the trader is 100% accountable and in control. If you blow it like an idiot youcan go home tomorrow or refund.. A brokerage that gives you buying power. So they do not hire a failed screen trader to assign you any types of restrictive metrics. TST is NOT a prop firm, so check your facts, again with your bogus misleading information. AND the CEO and his TST team, who are all apperantly failed screen traders, provide restrictions/metrics to other screen traders. Failed screen traders who don't know sht about profitable screen trading provide metrics on other screen traders' accounts for the purpose of their FUNDING and DEVELOPMENT. Who said that they are a scam? Are you a degenerate? They are a LEGIT company and Michael Patak is a legit fantastic guy and business man. Please re-read the claims with Their PROOF and SUPPORTING EVIDENCE. I am talking business here. Not personal. All of these men are fantastic however I am lookkng at their BUSINESS intentions and providing you supporting evidence. Again you fail to address any of my claims and fail to provide supportkng evidence. And again, instead, you acuse me of bogus. And MISLEAD by pretending that I called this company a scam when I said in my posts they are a LEGIT company. That is not my claim. Please reread look at the evidence. Challenge the claims with YOUR SUPPORTING EVIDENCE and not with your MISLEADING INFORMATION AND BOGUS ACCUSATIONS. I understand that you want to become a screen trader and since you never ran a business it is hard to believe this is how businesses work. And it is hard to let go of your dream of making money from daytradng with this opportunity, but undertand what business is. And understand what making a claim is, what providing supporting evidence is, and what challenging a claim with supportig evidence is. I am being attacked with misleadingg information left right so I did not know who you were. Since people can't provide evidence, are proven wrong or agree, leave and another one pops out with some bulshit, so sorry for the last post.
I'm not trying to disparage Topstep. I'm merely trying to understand why people go with them to begin with? Futures don't require a lot of money to trade. Couldn't a new trader just open an account somewhere and paper trade? Is it purely for the structure and advice that Topstep provides? Also curious about their commissions. They seem rather high. Couldn't this company become an exchange member and get much lower rates? Perhaps they've done this and just use commissions as a large source of income.
Paper trading involves no emotions. Zero. I've rarely met an unprofitable paper trader. The opposite is true of TST. I use to manage a regional prop firm office and the amount of money people lose trading futures is staggering. The response I always get from people is, oh well they should just stop once they lose a certain amount of money. THAT IS THE PROBLEM. They can't. If they HAD that discipline and control to begin with, they wouldn't need TST. The problem is they don't and they don't just drop 2k or 5k but 25k to 50k to 100k. The spiral goes fast. Regarding fees, the T4 platform is pricey. I currently use the platform with an FCM and pay $1 a side with a 1000 month cap on it. So back that out and they are charging $3 RT of which 2.42 of that is exchange fees. Could they get member rates? Sure but honestly, I don't think they do the volume to really make it worth it.