I don't think the n-th debate of language vs. language is really helpful here, all that has been discussed a million times in as many threads through out the internet. Its a not yet released open source project - and apparently the basic design is not finished yet (wayne added streaming just the other day), but already there are plans to support, maintain and develop it in three different languages. I guess when (if) this project is released, the amount of people actively participating will ground some of the ideas here.
Welcome to the world of open source. You will find out soon enough how many people are willing to work on a C# open source project. By that I mean how many people are willing to hack for free. Along with all the debate it brings.
Hoping and all the knowledge with software is not going to get you far in this sector, you need money, solid finances which he clearly has none. So this is a pipe dream. And to be clear i doubt he has a clue what he is talking about here. Just what he is calming he already has is BS to me.
Well, unexpectedly there's a new motivation to release TickZOOM--to prove it really exists. *smile* And that's very flattering that what I have built here is so impressive that some people think it's "impossible" or pipe dream, etc. Does anybody recommend a free or affordable video tool to record on the web? I would be happy to record a video (prior to releasing the software) showing the software and performance. Sincerely, Wayne
Its because the idea the microsoft actually did something very very right, is a slap in the face to the "religion" of the open source community.
So, tell us why it's a Good Thing(tm) to have the security and DRM straightjacket that Vista imposes on you and cannot be disabled?
Pippi, Thanks. Most all the threads and posts have become like yours--concerned when or if TickZOOM will be release and concerned about too much discussion about future benefits. You have been very kind, Pippi and so have many others via PM. I especially appreciate you reminding me of the memory limitation. So I chose you to repond to personally but I hope many others will read and respond to this post. This is a long post but extremely critical to the future of TickZOOM. Progress on Release Here's the progress on the 3 holdups to releasing: 1. Licensing (resolved as GPLv3) 2. Refactoring and testing the code for release (about 50% complete) 3. Researching how to fund ongoing development. (still open) I have been spending a lot of time the last few days discussing via PM how to fund the service of maintaining, supporting, and enhancing TickZOOM long term. But last night, I think, we reached a solution. I'd like feedback on this. TickZOOM is like Linux People keep drawing the comparison of TickZOOM to Linux as the "kernel" of automated trading systems. True, it is designed and will work that way. They ALSO draw the parallel that Linux is totally free and tick TickZOOM should be the same. However, I looked it up. Linux is not free. Linus, the creator if Linux receives funding to continue maintaining and supporting the codebase for Linux, even to this day, purely through donations by a mixture of individuals, resellers of Linux, acedemia, etc. For TickZOOM, the other poster is absolutely right, TickZOOM does NOT have funding to support long term support, maintenance and development at all. So it is absolutely a must that users somehow fund this project. Services Identified for TickZOOM to Sell After much discussion the following was decided. 1. The TickZOOM project funding will depend on paid services like maintaining the code base, fixing bugs, providing support. 2. Another huge service will be thoroughly testing TickZOOM for every release (which we plan to release weekly at the longest) for complete regression and QA testing, integration testing, volume testing, and live trade testing with real money. Testing and Reliability of TickZOOM Compared to Linux Linux in contrast to the service above has ZERO testing support. The only way to find out if the newest version works is to try running it for a while and report any bugs. THAT, obviously, is out of the question for trading software. New versions of TickZOOM must be 100% reliable. So the testing service certainly merits funding for all patches or fixes that either I make or other submit. Funding Plan (Needs FeedBack Please!) Therefore, to strongly encourage paid support agreements and to show the value of that support clearly, TickZOOM will only offer previous versions of the system for FREE. To get the latest version with all the bug fixes, enhancements, complete testing and other services, it will be necessary for users to pay for a service plan. I haven't decided on pricing yet. But it appears AmiBroker and NinjaTrader are the closest competitors for setting pricing. In contrast, they RENT software and or sell licenses. We will only sell services. So TickZOOM will always have an excellent (previous) version available for free and trial. Only those who want or need the latest features will pay for a service agreement. The Release Schedule/Plan First the Testing Tool So the plan for release right now is to first release the testing tool (which includes the TickZOOM engine) for FREE to go through beta testing for one month. I plan for this to happen during the month of January. During that time, registered users will get updates as soon as released just by clicking update for FREE. Those beta testers will also get 3 months server agreement for FREE as a reward for testing and reporting bugs. However, new users will only have access to one of the previous versions for FREE, the full beta-tested version will require a paid service agreement. After we have the second version available, then version 1 will become the FREE version and so on. Immediately After, the Execution Server Next, we'll release the Execution service for beta testing. It pulls down live quotes from MB Trading into a file and for real time charting in TickZOOM format. It also also you to trade your system from your PC. (but not in black box mode--that's a separate component.) That will go more quickly because it's less complex than the TickZOOM engine and it has been running 24 hours a day collecting ticks for weeks, reliably, and even as I type this. So it works. Then, after people have tried it out and verified it works, it will become available to those with paid service agreements only. Finally, the Black Box Server Last, the order server a.k.a. the black box server allows you to deploy your strategy to a PC with charts, log off, and leave it running 24 hours a day. It connects to the Execution server to get real time quotes and execute trades. It logs stats in HTML format and logs files. We will immediately work on making this run on Mono/Linux because servers with 24 hours support for Windows could about $200-$300 per month while Linux servers costs less than half that much. Of course, you never want to run the black box on your home PC. Very unwise for many reasons. Specific Feedback Need Again, I want to know if people think this is a good plan AND respond whether they think they can afford (if not why are they thinking about trading?) to pay for the service plan after seeing proof with a trial of the perfomance and features I stated on the official project description. What if Funding Plan Rejected? I'm completely open to making slight adjustments to this funding plan. But if the response is that people expect this to go on for free with out any funding, then the game is over. I will not release it at all. Forget it. Life is too short to spend working for people for free. Would you do it? Of course not. Benefits of User Funding Vs. Venture Capital Note if you fund this yourselves without Venture Capitalists stepping in, it will always stay affordable. That's the real beauty of Linux. The overwhelming feeling from people is that TickZOOM should not become a commercial entity. I'm willing to setup a 501(c)3 as a non profit if that will make people happier. That's how Linus gets funding by the way. Fight Venture Capitalists Real programmers like Linus and myself aren't greedy capitalists. No, we love good quality software and both want to share it with others and enjoy their appreciation for it. (I'm speaking for Linus only from what I read about him--never spoken with him.) The key to that is keeping it very affordable. If enough people latch on to TickZOOM so I have more than enough to buy groceriess, I will lower service agreement prices to make it possible for MORE people enjoy the work. Certainly, Linus enjoys all the affection people have for Linux--and that's the greatest reward. I also feel honored by the kind words here on ET at least for what I "claim" to have accomplished. But it will be more exciting to imagine the reaction when people experience it for themselves. Surely, Linus agrees on the point that software should not make programmers or Venture Capitalists rich. However, programmers must be paid, reasonably. So the first financial goal is to sell enough service contracts so that I can do TickZOOM development and maintenance full time just like Linus. My Personal Committment to Users of TickZOOM I'm very sorry TickZOOM can't be totally free but I will work my TAIL END OFF to deserve your support by fixing bugs quickly, adding more speed and keeping TickZOOM 100% reliable to trade with real money--hands free. Most interestingly, I use to trade my own real money. I think that's a plus to know I have money at stake on this too. I hope we can make this work. I LOVE writing software, especially really FAST software. And fortunately, unlike most programmers, I LOVE testing software to make it absolutely reliable and bug free. I hate bugs with a passion. I consider every bug an embarrassement. (That's part of the delay of releasing, I'm retesting everything too. You do want me to test it, right?) Finally, A Call for Your Support So please consider that if TickZOOM is as promised that you will pay a reasonable price for service comparable to AmiBroker license prices. Please let's work together to make the trading open source tools better than anyone every dreamed to give you complete control of your trading systems! Sincerely, Wayne
Please everyone, let's stop the debate on Windows and versus open source. TickZOOM will support both. Initially Linux support will be Via Mono and interop with C++. Later, ports to other languages. In the meantime, TickZOOM will do everything possible to Support C# Java and C++ for custom strategies. I already have some code that calls a Java business rules engine. That code can server as example of how to connect to Java code from TickZOOM. Maybe someone can contribute links or examples showing how to connect C# to C++ with examples soon. I will as do it myself as soon as I have time if noone else does. After this post, I will ask the moderator to simply delete any posts related to Window vs Open source. or discussion of programming languages, etc. Sincerely, Wayne