Thoughts on long OTM SPY calls

Discussion in 'Options' started by Sotnis, Oct 15, 2015.

  1. smile

    smile

    "IV for these 225 calls is about .11 vs about .16 for the ATM 200 calls"

    Contrast these with the puts, where you have to go all the way to the 113-116 strikes to find similarly priced puts.

    The IV for these put strikes is about .44 or about 4X that of the calls.

    The delta is well below 1 for the 113-116 puts.
     
    #11     Oct 15, 2015
  2. smile

    smile

    Not surprisingly, SPY seems to be the best bet for this strategy of buying far OTM calls about 3 months out.

    It's easy to forget that for these to payoff, we either need a decent rally OR almost any kind of selloff.

    I looked at VXX, IWM, AAPL and SPY seems to offer the best reward to risk considering the parameters of price of the calls, delta, vega, IV, OI, volume.
     
    #12     Oct 15, 2015
  3. smile

    smile

    Looking at the greeks for the 225 calls, the delta is .015 and vega is .12.

    So a $1 up move in price only $0.015 increase in the price of the option.

    A 1 point up move in IV increases the option price $.12 or about 2X what was paid for it.
     
    #13     Oct 15, 2015
  4. smile

    smile

    A several point up move in IV seems likely over the next 3 months.
     
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    #14     Oct 15, 2015
  5. I have a thought... You will get crushed, pulverized, ground to dust.
     
    #15     Oct 15, 2015
    Chubbly likes this.
  6. prc117f

    prc117f

    nothing wrong with throwing 300 bucks on that trade. if its just 1 dollar ITM out of sheer luck you could have a 10K profit.

    or lose 300 bucks, but use it as a tax write off. You dont get that with lotto tickets. :)
     
    #16     Oct 15, 2015
  7. I wouldn't take a strike that is that far (225). With the close today breaking resistance and volume growing, my take is 210 as a target in less than a month. So my recommendation is some Dec 2015 calls, strike 210 if you really want to be speculative, or strike 202 if you want to be safe with theta. This game is about constant gains, not big gains sporadic gains.
     
    #17     Oct 16, 2015
  8. smile

    smile

    "I'm currently looking at OTM SPY 225 calls for Jan 16. Right now these are going for .03 to .04."

    These calls have done well, not because of any IV change but because of a nice SPY uptrend.

    The IV has hardly changed.
     
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    #18     Nov 6, 2015
  9. VTS

    VTS


    There is something wrong with it through. Successful trading strategies aren't one offs. In order to grow a fund you have to do it consistently for longer periods of time.

    You can't just say oh it's only 300 bucks, because that doesn't account for all the other times you're going to have to do these same types of trades in the long run in order to finally get one that pays off.

    And if you've studied option trading, you'd probably already know that betting on 2+ SD OTM moves is a losing strategy in the long run.

    So why even bother with this trade? If it's a one off, it's not worth it. If it's going to be repeated many times in the future, again not worth it.


    Just stick to a high number of occurrences of high probability trades, and let statistics be your friend.
     
    #19     Nov 6, 2015
    OddTrader likes this.
  10. Victory5

    Victory5

    Eh....the VIX is pretty low at this point, so I dont think you're going to get crushed as much as you might think. Sure if the market pops another 10-15% by new years, you're going to have the VIX a touch lower, but its not going to be cataclysmic for your vol considerations.

    If you're buying puts with deltas that close to 0, you're going to be more worried about actually getting a move in your favor that slight changes in IV.
     
    #20     Nov 8, 2015