There Must Be Some Other UK People?

Discussion in 'Trading' started by Helenqu, Aug 20, 2002.

  1. hughmac



    its not that we don't know, its just that we do not have the initial capital to take part at that level.

    However by using relatively small amounts and with experience it is possible to survive. I certainly don't make the kind of income that you mention.

    By comparison, reading some of the posts on this board other forms of trading are just as fraught.

    Every BB has a hard core of members usually with strong opinions about how trading should be done!

    You have to allow other posters time to get used to your style and method of trading, after all you are the unproven newbie!

    Ther is no hiding in a chat room when you post your trades for everyone to see and comment on!

    If you can "walk the talk" then you will gain respect and other members will pay heed!

    Lead by example and others will follow, so i look forward reading your posts and watching you trade in the t2w chatroom!

    By the way, this site is sponsored in part by training companies and individuals, the top poster on this site (Don Bright) is a trainer i believe.



    :) :)
    #21     Aug 21, 2002
  2. stevet


    i honestly dont get it

    you said before

    " have earned my keep from spreadbetting, paid the mortgage, kids fees etc using this source and cant fault it!"

    that means you are saying you making a good amount of money, even if it is less than 50K, must be 20K surely, so why cant you scale up with your profit and make more and or use futures

    this type of confusion is what made it hard to have discussions on trade2win, everyone is an expert at making money with spreadbetting, but everyone feels it is just a hobby - if anyone truly made money at spreadbetting, i repeat that they would make a small fortune at futures and it does not cost that much to start

    making money is making a profit - on average - over a period of time - using the same average value of trade

    spreadbetting gets defended as a great way to learn and a great way to make money - the reality is that it may be a great way to learn trading - because it is impossible to make money at it - and therefore it may cause those who do want to make money to develop strategys which when applied to futures - will make them a lot of money

    making money is making a profit - on average - over a period of time - using the same average value of trade

    you are right that reading posts on here shows that other types of trading are difficult - but unfortunatly this is a proof that spreadbetting is impossible and the reason i say that is that spreadbetting is like trading futures, but with all the cards stacked against you - the spreadbettors just dont realise how obvious it is to futures traders how nuts it is to claim to make a profit at spreadbetting

    i repeat that i am not against spreadbetting -just against the people who claim to be able to teach people to make a profit doing it - by claiming they are succesful at it , but it is just a hobby etc

    i did not go onto trade2win to prove anything, let alone seek respect, i went on there to see if there were any real traders on there i could learn from - and was amazed at the lack of knowledge, and then disgusted when people purporting to be trainers started to appear

    its amazing that you have made that comment as did a lot of the mafia on there - about others getting used to my style or whatever, am direct and straightforward - i will give my view of someone elses comments and expect to have to defend my own comments - no one disagreed with me - with points about what i said - they just said i should not say them!

    but as one guy on trade2win said, no one is debating stevets points - they are just saying he is saying them in the wrong way - this is such a british tradition

    trading is a battle - there are no second places - its not about bowler hats anymore or working mens caps - its about those who try and those who dont

    you are right - don bright is on here as a trainer - but he is upfront about it and his training is part of his trading bureau setup which is really what he markets - he is one knowlegable guy whose comments although always loaded to promotiing his own business, show he knows his stuff and is very experienced, i would eat major shit to discuss trading with him on a regular basis as i would end up making money from listening to him

    please dont even dream there is anyone on trade2win who purports to be a trainer, who has a clue

    p.s. i have made money spreadbetting - i used spreadbetting for over a year to see if i could get an edge on them - i have made on one day, 450 points out of the dow in a couple of hours, and then doubled that by the end of the day, i have made hundreds of points out of the ftse dax s&p, that from outright positions, i have made money out of the faults in the algorythms they use between cash and futures prices, and also arbing, but the unreliablity of the trading platforms and the difficulty of getting in and out at the right price make it impossible to make sure that your wins will outnumber your losses, trading is mainly about minimising losses, not just winning - and just so there is no confusion - i made money out of spreadbettting when there was so much volatility in the markets, that i could get great positions and momentum would take me trhough the danger zone - its a different game now
    #22     Aug 21, 2002
  3. Helenqu


    Hi Steve,

    With spreadbetting I just about break even at the moment. Which I think is an OK state for me, being part time and only a year into trading. But I do recognise that spreadbetting is like running a marathon with a sack of coal on your back. And I certainly don't envisage me using sbs when I finally manage to focus full time on trading. But at the moment it is a cheap way to gain experience and test systems out.

    I am also aware of a good half dozen or so people off my board and T2W who are moving from Sbs to e-minis at the current time. I suspect in a years time you will find a good few more sophisticated UK traders about. I hope so anyway :)

    #23     Aug 21, 2002
  4. stevet
    "just a shame there is nothing like elite so that some more aggressive traders could correspond in the UK or even europe.and their correspondence would help kids to get a handle on the opportunities in trading"

    In my experience by far the best UK BB site is the Premium Section of ADVFN.
    There are numerous professional traders on this BB who make their income trading Spreadbets, CFDs, Futures, Options and Equities. Click on the Premium BB tab, membership is £5 per month I believe. (I'm no longer a member, concentrating solely on US markets, but I have met up with quite a few of the guys on the BB and they are genuine).
    #24     Aug 21, 2002
  5. stevet



    thank you for that

    i had forgotten all about them - i remember a long time ago when they were starting up and they were just going to be a data supply and charting company - they gave me some sort of beta version - but it just did not work and then i think they remembered that they had to do a deal with the LSE!

    they seemed dead keen and enthusiastic though - did they ever get the data and charting thing together?

    i am pretty much focused on the US though as well, just seems embarrasing that london is such a finance centre, but that trading in the UK is so underground and quaint!

    i blame the fsa - no one can promote trading, but the pensions and funds can piss away peoples life savings - ridiculous!
    #25     Aug 21, 2002
  6. stevet



    the second that people move from sbs to futures, they will take a huge leap in the learning curve

    if you are breaking even, you are doing real real well, from that foundation, you just need to improve 1% and you will be on your way

    if you are breaking even on spreadbetting though, you will make a fortune on futures just as u r - i'd back you

    thats partly why i went on trade2win - to see if they're were any traders worth backing - did not get far!
    #26     Aug 21, 2002
  7. Helenqu



    Would you do me a favour and cast your eye over this post of mine on TMF? It's a summary of my first years trading.

    I'm after as much feedback as I can get on it, don't worry about being critical that fine :)


    #27     Aug 21, 2002
  8. stevet


    sorry - could not see what u were trading - i am assuming it was the dow - either cash or futures - at least in the terms the spreadbettors use?
    #28     Aug 21, 2002
  9. Helenqu


    Hi Steve,

    Was a mix of Dow cash, FTSE Cash and UK stocks. Mostly FTSE and Dow though.

    #29     Aug 21, 2002
  10. stevet


    its impossible to quantify, without knowing all the details

    and with the ftse at half the dow, the number of applicable points make a big difference - you cant average out wins from one against losses on the other

    it was good to read it - and it was good to see the importance of losses in your understanding of trading, but the question has to be, would u bet a £100 a point, if not, u know the answer as to your own level

    thats one of the problems of talking about profits trading with spreadbetting - the use of low amounts stops u getting to the biggest problem of trading and this is your emotion

    i personally feel that u cannot trade without a real understanding of TA, but an understanding of how to trade off of TA - which is a big difference to understanding TA, and then far more important is just learning to be in control when in a loss situation, which is all about ourselves, and that is key to succesful trading if you have not developed a computer generated trading system to unemotionally kick in and out of trades

    i am no way an expert, i am still learning and learn some bloody new thing everyday, but that is because there is an awful lot to learn, and each bit of learning just makes trading easier, yu dont need to know it all, just enough to win, and then just keep learning to make the winning easier

    by the way, a lot of succesful traders kick in hundreds of trades a day, dont worry about volume - worry about learning from losses and then how to get winners
    #30     Aug 21, 2002