The "wager" mindset

Discussion in 'Psychology' started by turkeyneck, Jan 9, 2018.

  1. rvince99

    rvince99

    First, what do you mean "focus on setups?" What is a "setup?" I have a suspicion it has something to do with trade entries, which is the last thing in the list of things you need to be looking at to try to do what you want to do.

    Secondly, "six-figure income" representing what percentage on your stake, annually?

    Next, I assume that "2k/week," is what you need to take out per week from the account, not what you plan to make trading per week, each and every week. I assume there is some modicum of reality in what you want to do. In other words, you would like to take out $100,000 / year in trading capital.

    First, you don;t take out a fixed dollar amount on fixed intervals. The game is difficult enough, and this only makes the slope steeper. (Having to make X dollar in a fixed time period steepens the slope to the breaking point already). You take out a percentage, not a fixed dollar amount, and that percentage each year better to be less than the three year average or you won't be able to sustain yourself. So if your three year average annual return is 21%/year, then you can look to take out 20% year (because you will have losing years. Yes, you will, unless you're involved in private lending, which it doesn't sound like you are, you will).

    So if you have a stake of 500,000 and you make 21%/yr, you could take out 20% of the stake each year. Put that in a separate account, divide by 52 and take that amount out of that account each week for your living expenses. Accommodate your lifestyle to live within this amount or go drive an Uber at nights to make ends meet.
     
    #11     Jan 10, 2018
    Xela likes this.
  2. Robert Morse

    Robert Morse Sponsor

    I see nothing wrong with this mindset as long as you still make good decisions for the right reasons. When I was a market maker, I had a daily goal. Every morning, I was willing to take a little extra risk to meet that goal before 11am. If I did, I would then take lower risk the rest of the day. If there was nothing to do, I still did nothing. It just gave me, a naturally conservative trader, the ability to do more when appropriate.
     
    #12     Jan 10, 2018
  3. themickey

    themickey

    Forget the 6 figure income and forget the 2k/week.
    You have very little control, the market giveth and the market taketh away.
    The best you can do, is do your best, everything else then will fall into place.
    Your confidence may well get hurt if you set unattainable ambitions.
    The golden rule on trading is "preserving capital", and not being focused on profits.
     
    #13     Jan 10, 2018
  4. Xela

    Xela


    I think the best way to drop the "need to make $2k per week" mindset is probably to be in a position in which you don't "need to make $2k per week".

    (And without laboriously reiterating absolutely everything already said above, for me it's a rare thread in which I agree with every single post made so far. It's pretty difficult to say much more, constructively, without knowing far more detail about your financial curcumstance, account-size, trading methodology and so on.)
     
    #14     Jan 10, 2018
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  5. Ditto!

    For the OP... A trader's only objective should be to "trade well".... (1) make the plays you should, and (2) protect capital.

    And let's not forget the "80/20" rule.... that is, "80% of your gains will come from 20% of your trades". The better trades don't necessarily "arrive on time" as per your "weekly" desire for them.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2018
    #15     Jan 10, 2018
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  6. volente_00

    volente_00

    100% chance you fail if you are trading with scared money. If you are attempting to trade full time without other streams of income then you should have at least one year of living expenses in a separate account that is just for your monthly nut and not touchable for trading.
    Scared money is dead money
    I know it sounds simplistic but it is the honest truth.
     
    #16     Jan 10, 2018
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  7. jinxu

    jinxu

    What if you're someone who has no fear? Would you give him the same advice?
     
    #17     Jan 10, 2018
  8. $2k a week is definitely possible, even with a small $2k trading account. But of course it's much easier, and calmer, with a 200k account.
    It all depends on what you trade, and how. If you like money, you have to trade aggressively. -- but with Skill and experience and wisdom too, if you hope to survive and thrive.
    Everything about the market falls on that classic Risk vs Reward color spectrum. If you want that window of opportunity for big or bigger gains, you will have to also open that window that exposes you to potential risks.

    As a beginner, I wouldn't get too obsessed with establishing goals. It can drive you nuts...as another person said...focus on The Process of the trade, not the money.

    If you focus on the process of the trade...you may even find out, you are now making 4k/week...and then 9k/week. Growth and compounding within trading may surprise you, rather quickly. -- but of course that works both ways too, with regards to the losses.
    It's important the mechanics and ideologies behind your trading are not derive from just being a basic, dumb gambler. Make sure you have something Real within you.

    Don't go chasing random, many setups and trades...like you're chasing random girls to get laid.
    Have a soulmate...that you like to trade. You're way more likely to be profitable if you're a Master of One, not a jack of all trades.

    I thought you're new, you were registered since Dec '07...if you haven't learned the market in ten years...chances are you will never.
    Make Trading Great Again 2018...High-Five` :sneaky:
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2018
    #18     Jan 10, 2018
    themickey likes this.
  9. ElCubano

    ElCubano

    If this is not the case you should not be trading. Unless you are living with your parents which is ok in my book. Mommas boy!!
     
    #19     Jan 10, 2018
  10. rvince99

    rvince99

    Fear has little to do with it.If he had no fear I'd tell him to go out and trade it balls out at the growth-optimal level -- and all else be damned. This is a different exercise than "having to make 2k/week," which is an entirely wrong approach to take to trading or endeavors involving risk, and flies in the face of any rules pertaining to survivability and prudence.

    I'm not saying it cannot be done, but as I mentioned earlier, you better be able to make that kind of return (not "hope" or "think" you an make some sort of unrealistic return as the markets character morphs from year to year, which means starting out with a big enough stake such that the return is do-able. Secondly, you don;t take out fixed dollar amounts. You take out fixed percentage amounts. Why sabotage yourself?
     
    #20     Jan 10, 2018