The Ultimate DAX Scalping Discussion Thread!

Baruch · Dec 31, 2003

Oh, yes he does. In the last chapters of the book.

Grob109 · Dec 31, 2003

Quote from ElectricSavant:

Jack,

I always appreciate your thought provoking posts. It is my own inabilities that I cannot understand. So please do not take this reply as a discredit to your style/trading ability. I have parsed below what I do not understand....You can reply if you want and I understand if you do not. But all I ask is please do not take this as an offense as it is not my meaning. When reading my remarks please change the tone of voice in your head not to reflect the mood and the feeling generally felt here in ET. This is a serious and a sincere post.
i understand, appreciate and wlecome your perspective and the work you did to do this followup.

Scientist is imparting to us a wholistic approach

What does, "wholistic" mean when used in trading?

scientist strives for getting the whole nine yards (a full bolt of cloth in the olden days). He and I feel that the market can be traded almost continually using techniques that continually apply as the open market goes along. I refer to it as SCT, meaning seamless continuous trading. It gets most complex when risk is handled. The various periodicities of the market can be treated in an FA manner. When they are, it may be conclused that, risk wise, they are independant of each other and thus may have indepenant applications of capital applied to them. Holistic therefore means that we can bring everything to bear to make money in a given market. We need to do this to enrich the context of trading.

for DAX. I see he carries over a lot of stuff from his past posts for other markets

ok

Improving what he does really requires a focus on developing his personal efficiency for the range of market efficiencies to deliver profits. He discerns that the DAX yield is a little over twice the ES at this point in time and liquidity of markets.

ok

I use a "yellow brick road" excel spread sheet

I have seen this spreadsheet. I do not understand it. Could you explain in detail what it is? Is it "Maximum Adverse Excursion" and "Maximum Favorable Excursion" from entry? or is it sort of a money management sheet?

To make money people need to choose where to do it. Two factors prevail. How good a market is and how good we are. I use the H/L of the period available to rough out how much capital can be extracted if I fully use the opportunity. The potential is a multiple of the H/L spread. So I look at various period lengths. I call these fractals based upon the idea that I perceive that there is a universal kind of approach that can be applied within each of these periods. I use this fact as a test element for the efficacy of the given approach. So I have seven periods that i consider. You see them on the spread sheet. that sets up the yield for verious periods. I call this an efficiency. An ability to deliver money from that period. It is not the MAE and MFE that others use re entry.

I also look at personal efficiency. People by their nature can do stuff best in one or sometimes more settings. Where I live we process meat. You may not know this but some people can bone much better than others just because of their heritage. Pele was a model for me. I could not achieve as he did. This applies to a person vis a vis trading. Some periodicities are better for some people. They can efficiently take money out of the market because they gather, analyze, decide and act appropriately in a given timing context.

The yellow brick road is a spread sheet that puts constants (coefficients) into play to show how efficiencies combine between a person and the market. Most people cannot operate on the 1 min fractal at all. They get better if they slow down. The market, however gives less to us over time on the slower fractals. this helper is designed to let a person explore an assortment of combinations in order to make a match with the market. All of this is in the context of trading continually.

for each market to check out the various fractal market

What is fractal? How is this used as an efficiency?

We orient to making money. From above, you see that fractals are periods of time that can be displayed on charts for TA, etc. scalps, short, intermediate, and long term trends show up on these displays. In the extreme, compounding works best with highest frequencies when there is change to be captured. Buy and hold is the limiting case of slowness in compounding. You can make 70% profits on DELL per quarter if you trade the up and down cycles. This is very efficient compared to buy and hold. The caveat is timing. All of what I say addresses timing opportunities. So naturally I turn to looking at the efficiencies to get it to work. a quarterly chart of DELL lets you draw one line from entry to exit for buy and hold. mark in the trades for monthly. do weekly. do daily. do it all the way down to one minute. that is the yellow brick road. The money is there to take out as we all see.

and personal efficiencies.
More...

LongShot · Dec 31, 2003

Quote from ElectricSavant:

Jack,

I always appreciate your thought provoking posts. It is my own inabilities that I cannot understand. So please do not take this reply as a discredit to your style/trading ability. I have parsed below what I do not understand....You can reply if you want and I understand if you do not. But all I ask is please do not take this as an offense as it is not my meaning. When reading my remarks please change the tone of voice in your head not to reflect the mood and the feeling generally felt here in ET. This is a serious and a sincere post.

Scientist is imparting to us a wholistic approach

What does, "wholistic" mean when used in trading?

for DAX. I see he carries over a lot of stuff from his past posts for other markets

ok

Improving what he does really requires a focus on developing his personal efficiency for the range of market efficiencies to deliver profits. He discerns that the DAX yield is a little over twice the ES at this point in time and liquidity of markets.

ok

I use a "yellow brick road" excel spread sheet

I have seen this spreadsheet. I do not understand it. Could you explain in detail what it is? Is it "Maximum Adverse Excursion" and "Maximum Favorable Excursion" from entry? or is it sort of a money management sheet?

for each market to check out the various fractal market

What is fractal? How is this used as an efficiency?

and personal efficiencies.

ok

The DAX shape of things for all of us it that scalping is almost ever present as an action on the carrier fractals that give DAX the more than twice the efficiency of the ES.

Please explain your use of these words/phrases in this run on sentence above:

1)shape
2)action on the carrier fractals.

I think what your are saying is that when the ES moves, the DAX follows but it is not to the same scale.

By trading the carrier as well as scalping there is an additional leverage available. Details of this are best seen on AMT's posts and scientist is not doing this as yet. I should use better instead of best. ET is not a best place.

I think you are referring to AMT's balancing and "adding to" a trade also known as wash trades that you often elude to...right?

Staying in (majority of contracts) the slower fractal trends that give the higher efficiency, then, as well, using fewer contracts to scalp on that carrier at high frequencies,

Spikes? Out of scale reactions to movement? Position trading and balancing with little trades?

compounds the extraction and simultaneously spreads risk. Each separate stream of capital application has it's own R/R characteristic.

Well true, he does not exit everything at the end of the session.

I see that just two variables are needed on each carrier periodicity

carrier?

and that these pairs are not necessarily tightly linked. No nonsense regards this as bull$hit. To make my comment more reasonable for consideration, I will amplify it.

Why do you use this word amplify.....usually this is used in electronics via high fidelity discussions? I do agree its a colorful word though.

A theorist at Berkley, Alexander, deals in performance and the advantage of least connectedness as an advantage for success.

Do you mean those that care the least win?

Scientist requested input, so this is mine.

ok

I use pairs to minimally define.

What does this mean? do you watch other instruments as a leading indicator of the DAX?

I will go through the fractals of DAX and define the pairs.

What?

Pairs are elegantly limited to 4 combinations and permutations. they sequence in time it turns out. This is a profound element of making money.

permutations? what does this word mean?

I force you, sort of, to view what I say6 by my descriptions. It is important that you yield momentarily to this setting and environment. it is not going to trap you or disturb you any more than you want it to. I am not putting you at risk but I am attempting to open some views for you.

ok

The slower fractals form plexiglass clear spheres outside of one another. You see clearly into the center where the scalping domain operates. By this and in this manner you have a province from outside to view scalping. There is, thus, and everpresent context. The context tempers the NOW.

I have no idea what you said? Should I go to home depot and buy plexiglass?

Scalping is asymptotic to NOW.

This is so kewl....but what does it mean?

The pair for scalping is a price pair: cash and futures values. since change is the only way to make money. We look at their time based dynamic. All you do is look at the relative offset values and deterimine if their is a smaller difference (squeese) or a larger difference (stretch), all relative to the neutral value of the offset. This phenomena precedes the scalping opportunity. squeese is long and stretch is short.

I see....but could you use 2 futures symbols instead?

The next sphere outward it the immediate trend pairing.

what?

Use the button plug in or the market depth.

What?

Bbid and Bask are the pair in the context of the portion of the depth presented to you. (only half of the story is on the screen). Size is the variable.

What?

The immediate trend is controlled by the least valued variable AND the filling in of values. You read it by watching the Bbid/Bask spread pair change. You always know what is next through the dynamic. The the pair changes leading to another adjacent pair. After the change is "sticks" or not. If not, the fillibration (you can laugh or smile) is between two pairs and they resonate in every changing periods of presence. You can see this immediate trend flowing along.

ok

With just two levels of stuff, you have a context from the slower and a focus from the fast scalp center. I cheat a little. I use a leading pair of cash and futures values for my first pair. Example: INDU and YM04H as a pair lead the ESo4H scalp. Scientist covered the leading stuff of DAX for you already and other corroborated his view.

ok

To further strengthen these two concentric plexiglass spheres,

what?

we add another which is asymmetric instead of uniform

what?

as are the first two. This larger sphere is the bane of most.

larger sphere...what is bane?

And they also are not conscious of it's import and why it works against them pervasively.

conscious?, are they living? and what did you just say?

The market flows with a propensity. But that also means, clearly, then that opposites do not apply. You must, for the moment, regard what I say to you. Flush it down the toilet, later, if you must.

ok

The most important fractal comes up here.

fractal...there that word again...could it be replaced with the word, "point"

It, of course, is the carrier of the two above periodicities.

carrier?

What makes it so important is that it is asymmetric reasoning wise.

what?

The two variables yield combinations and permutaions that are not opposites.

what are you talking about I am totally lost now. and feeling inadequete. I want to understand and follow along

Further, these two variables are the driving forces of any market. Price and volume.

ok

For this set of combinations and permutations, I need to really plunge you into a thinking effort that is rock solid and unswerving in its logic. I will post it ASAP just to be able to separate it from the above temporarily. Later, I will try to amplify on scientist's posts here to give something specific to him to consider.

Jack, I want to think and understand ok? please help...maybe there is no hope. I know your thinking, what do I need to do for electric?.....he needs to go back to school....this is not my problem!

Michael B.
More...

wow what a looong post! :eek:

Grob109 · Dec 31, 2003

Quote from ElectricSavant:

Jack,

The DAX shape of things for all of us it that scalping is almost ever present as an action on the carrier fractals that give DAX the more than twice the efficiency of the ES.

Please explain your use of these words/phrases in this run on sentence above:

1)shape

[color] This is an inclusive comment. I meant to just depict the nature and character of DAX. The DAX is terrific for making money. To make money we need trending and good movement. Scientist started the thread with an observation and thank you for being apprised of the DAX opportunity. he characterized it quantitatively as well. Thats where I got excited. Daily,the DAX outmove the ES in terms of making money. this is roughed out by scientist as a ratio of the average movements in the context of money made per unit of movement. There is a big opportunity on DAX compared to ES. I called it "shape".[/color]
2)action on the carrier fractals.

I think what your are saying is that when the ES moves, the DAX follows but it is not to the same scale.

[color] No, this is not what I said. I sure see how what I said was not on the mark. Action is a term I use for extracting money. I was saying this kind of thing. when a person looks at charts on differing periods, the slower the chart the smoother it looks. I call it "taping". Taping means that each bar fills the trend envelope. this means to me that it is very efficient to just buy and hold for the trend shown and do not worry about the forming of the bars.

To make a finer point, I suggest to people to just move to the next slower fractal to see taping and then stay there to time exits and/or reversals. DAX is such that doing this is not a common occurance. This means that a person can extract more money by trading the traverses within trends on the faster fractals. This, in it's limit, is the definition of scalping most efficiently.

We could rank RL, ES, NQ, YM and DAX by whether or not moving to next lower speed (slower) fractal would give us taping more often. DAX is one where we would stick with trading traverses within trends more often. Thus DAX has more action for us to extract capital since it tapes less often. That is the position strategy of AMT in the current contest and he primarily couples it with the margin differences between intra and position requirements which is 6 to one at the limit (he uses 5).[/color]

By trading the carrier as well as scalping there is an additional leverage available. Details of this are best seen on AMT's posts and scientist is not doing this as yet. I should use better instead of best. ET is not a best place.

I think you are referring to AMT's balancing and "adding to" a trade also known as wash trades that you often elude to...right?

yes right on. he is trading the carrier and then the short erm intraday moves and he does some scalps when volume is low midday.

Staying in (majority of contracts) the slower fractal trends that give the higher efficiency, then, as well, using fewer contracts to scalp on that carrier at high frequencies,

Spikes? Out of scale reactions to movement? Position trading and balancing with little trades?

Let me be extreme to extinguish the moves you mention except last sentence. Look at the long term, intermedieat term and short term trends. For ES you have a quarterly front month long term. Then the IT's within it are about a dozen in number. Daily you see three to five traverses of the IT that is on. give yourself 200 points a quarter for long term. add in 12 thirty pointers. do the daily traverses at 3 to five points (3 to 5 times three to five times 90). These independant periods build the potential for three segments of capital. at it's simplest run a segmented account keeping funds separate. Or AMT it.

Finally you can scalp it too.

Your last sentence covers what I said above.

compounds the extraction and simultaneously spreads risk. Each separate stream of capital application has it's own R/R characteristic.

Well true, he does not exit everything at the end of the session.

I see that just two variables are needed on each carrier periodicity

carrier?

Carrier is the engeering expression for the fundamental frequency the information is carried on. In fractals, all the variations showing on each are kind of buried as you look at slower and slower fractals. The fastest frequencies have the lowest amplitudes (variation) so they get buried.

I use the easiest things to be seen for each level of fractal. Since so much data is being imposed upon us for trading, I try to use a minimalist approach and use as littl stuff as possible to get the job done. Since there is this major anomoly hanging around out there, keeping it simple is very important.

and that these pairs are not necessarily tightly linked. No nonsense regards this as bull$hit. To make my comment more reasonable for consideration, I will amplify it.

Why do you use this word amplify.....usually this is used in electronics via high fidelity discussions? I do agree its a colorful word though.

My heritage is showing. since the crib I have smelled soldering irons. Patents used to require models. I was short some partsin 7th or 8th grade for a DC amplifier. Dad said just use some series parallel circuits to get it to work out. BTL had open shelves for parts but he was too busy to pick up my list. lol. My lingo is sufused with this stuff.
More...

Grob109 · Dec 31, 2003

Quote from ElectricSavant:

Jack,

The DAX shape of things for all of us it that scalping is almost ever present as an action on the carrier fractals that give DAX the more than twice the efficiency of the ES.

Please explain your use of these words/phrases in this run on sentence above:

1)shape

This is an inclusive comment. I meant to just depict the nature and character of DAX. The DAX is terrific for making money. To make money we need trending and good movement. Scientist started the thread with an observation and thank you for being apprised of the DAX opportunity. he characterized it quantitatively as well. Thats where I got excited. Daily,the DAX outmove the ES in terms of making money. this is roughed out by scientist as a ratio of the average movements in the context of money made per unit of movement. There is a big opportunity on DAX compared to ES. I called it "shape".
2)action on the carrier fractals.

I think what your are saying is that when the ES moves, the DAX follows but it is not to the same scale.

[color] No, this is not what I said. I sure see how what I said was not on the mark. Action is a term I use for extracting money. I was saying this kind of thing. when a person looks at charts on differing periods, the slower the chart the smoother it looks. I call it "taping". Taping means that each bar fills the trend envelope. this means to me that it is very efficient to just buy and hold for the trend shown and do not worry about the forming of the bars.

To make a finer point, I suggest to people to just move to the next slower fractal to see taping and then stay there to time exits and/or reversals. DAX is such that doing this is not a common occurance. This means that a person can extract more money by trading the traverses within trends on the faster fractals. This, in it's limit, is the definition of scalping most efficiently.

We could rank RL, ES, NQ, YM and DAX by whether or not moving to next lower speed (slower) fractal would give us taping more often. DAX is one where we would stick with trading traverses within trends more often. Thus DAX has more action for us to extract capital since it tapes less often. That is the position strategy of AMT in the current contest and he primarily couples it with the margin differences between intra and position requirements which is 6 to one at the limit (he uses 5).[/color]

By trading the carrier as well as scalping there is an additional leverage available. Details of this are best seen on AMT's posts and scientist is not doing this as yet. I should use better instead of best. ET is not a best place.

I think you are referring to AMT's balancing and "adding to" a trade also known as wash trades that you often elude to...right?

yes right on. he is trading the carrier and then the short erm intraday moves and he does some scalps when volume is low midday.

Staying in (majority of contracts) the slower fractal trends that give the higher efficiency, then, as well, using fewer contracts to scalp on that carrier at high frequencies,

Spikes? Out of scale reactions to movement? Position trading and balancing with little trades?

Let me be extreme to extinguish the moves you mention except last sentence. Look at the long term, intermedieat term and short term trends. For ES you have a quarterly front month long term. Then the IT's within it are about a dozen in number. Daily you see three to five traverses of the IT that is on. give yourself 200 points a quarter for long term. add in 12 thirty pointers. do the daily traverses at 3 to five points (3 to 5 times three to five times 90). These independant periods build the potential for three segments of capital. at it's simplest run a segmented account keeping funds separate. Or AMT it.

Finally you can scalp it too.

Your last sentence covers what I said above.

compounds the extraction and simultaneously spreads risk. Each separate stream of capital application has it's own R/R characteristic.

Well true, he does not exit everything at the end of the session.

I see that just two variables are needed on each carrier periodicity

carrier?

Carrier is the engeering expression for the fundamental frequency the information is carried on. In fractals, all the variations showing on each are kind of buried as you look at slower and slower fractals. The fastest frequencies have the lowest amplitudes (variation) so they get buried.

I use the easiest things to be seen for each level of fractal. Since so much data is being imposed upon us for trading, I try to use a minimalist approach and use as littl stuff as possible to get the job done. Since there is this major anomoly hanging around out there, keeping it simple is very important.

and that these pairs are not necessarily tightly linked. No nonsense regards this as bull$hit. To make my comment more reasonable for consideration, I will amplify it.

Why do you use this word amplify.....usually this is used in electronics via high fidelity discussions? I do agree its a colorful word though.

My heritage is showing. since the crib I have smelled soldering irons. Patents used to require models. I was short some partsin 7th or 8th grade for a DC amplifier. Dad said just use some series parallel circuits to get it to work out. BTL had open shelves for parts but he was too busy to pick up my list. lol. My lingo is sufused with this stuff.
More...

Grob109 · Dec 31, 2003

Quote from ElectricSavant:

Jack,

A theorist at Berkley, Alexander, deals in performance and the advantage of least connectedness as an advantage for success.

Do you mean those that care the least win?

what alexander wanted us to learn was that in a system (take command and control in the military) if you organize it and divide it into parts, then it will work best if you have the groups divided into bunches so that there is least communication among the bunches. The bunches are sort of automomous. This is least connectedness. In a community, put the garbage collection, sewerage, water supply and hosptials in one pod. Who ever is running that group can make the whole system self policing without bugging the other parts of the community.

Here I am using pairs that have few connections to other elements. By only looking at four possibilities for each pair and observing that the possibilities come in sequences, i attain a least conneted system.

Further these pairs handle slower and slower periods as they go outfrom scalping.

I want to establish what is going on; what is next and how fast it is happening as least connected as possible.

If you can go bang, bang, bang instantaneously on all three pairs, you can then feel you are in the groove at all times.

This leads to "What wasn't that?" coming out of continuity very sharply. I am achieving connectedness of a person who is very efficient with a market that continually moves assets into your account. I am not monitoring assets though, I am monitoring the delivery system in a minimal way. The delivery system sequences these pairs. Any ending of one kind of delivery is segwayed into the next delivery opportunity.

Scientist requested input, so this is mine.

ok

I use pairs to minimally define.

What does this mean? do you watch other instruments as a leading indicator of the DAX?
I posted a Market log just after I PM'ed scientist. I couldn't attach it. I suggested that he just re label the top to do this plexiglass thing. He showed the leading indicators of the DAX so I just flipped him a chart layout to monitor them. I will follow up on this soon so that it is all done for you and it is made convenient. The next sections will also focus stuff.
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Baruch · Jan 1, 2004

Sorry, but I don't understand a word.

Trend Fader · Jan 1, 2004

And you really think GROB isnt Jack Hershey?

--MIKE

Scientist · Jan 1, 2004

Quote from dpanic:

It's a very funny coincidence you mention llama compost. That's exactly what I'm doing. I have some friends who have 6 llama and 6 minature donkeys. I made a deal with them, I lend them the use of my front end loader to move the compost piles in exchange for a years supply of llama compost. Very good stuff, lots of hay and llama stuff mixed together yield some awesome vegetables come spring.
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Quote from Grob109:

The yield on the compost is almost terrifying. LOL we weighed one carrot last year and it was about 3 1/2 pounds. Our citrous is a better example though. One weird lemmon like tree is making fruit at sizes that are largr than grapefruits. We make very large gin and fruit and vodka and fruit drinks. One of these babies juiced lasts a whole evening in a suitable bev container.

We are going to make cork bats this year for the majors out of zuccinis. Have you ever seen a rabbit explode in your garden???
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Llama kompost??? By Manitou! Just a few days of absence... What happened to my thread?

This thread has undergone a silent but violent metamorphosis into something rather strange.

We have people walking, stalking, flaming & talking about ..., llama compost, llamanetically modified citrus fruit and exploding rabbits. What was this thread just about? Ah yeah right. Scalping. Scalping DAX!

Would you find it unfair if I kindly asked the moderator to move the 'subject derailed' posts into a new thread, such as "DAX, Mad Scalpers & Llama Compost?", so we could regain the seriousness of the matter and topic? I'm sure the new thread would be even more spectacular, and become the new hangaround for just about anybody. And you people and your posts would be the pioneers!

Or maybe it's just a silly idea / terrible task for a moderator. Well I hope you all had a happy holiday and new year's eve! I sure had. I'm still off my face. Jeez, it seems more like all of you have been online all along... Wow, and I thought I was a tron...

I can't believe some of the members here though. One day before NYE, I got PM's from people asking me why the DAX had closed on them, "in the middle of the session". I mean, how dashed can you be? They seriously traded the DAX and didn't even read the trading schedules on the Eurex site (just one of many sources) to verify their times before trading? I don't intend to sound mean, but I think these certain people are unfit, i.e. lack the seriousness to trade futures, not to mention a contract like DAX. Sure anybody who understands what happens if you trade multiple contracts at a value of ~USD125,000 each and then the market opens with a gap, possibly days later - will know exactly what I mean. You either are serious or silly. Hardly anything p*sses me off, but these kind of things really do at times. Because clearly these people have no idea what "forward" or "future contract = forced settlement" means. If you trade futures, and you're down, you deliver. If you don't, "they" will deliver for you. "They" pay for that with your car, house, bank accounts, superannuation savings, etc and your last shirt. Everything you have. Those that don't even know their trading times, clearly can't be fully aware of the implications of this.

On the other hand, I would like to say that I am glad to see that (despite the trolls, which had to arrive - eventually) a few people have joined this thread which I highly respect as excellent, experienced and knowledgeable traders. These include Cutten, Grob109, trade4success and of course velocity_trader. Thank you all for joining and actually contributing some deep thoughts and substance!

I will be replying to all of you all in short time from here!

Cheers and Happy New Year!
Scientist

Scientist · Jan 1, 2004

Quote from ElectricSavant:

I don't believe you trade at all.....

Michael B.
More...

Nice try, Electric. Nice try!

Just FYI, the blackmail or provocation thing doesn't pull with me.
Didn't I make it clear that I have no intent to prove anything?

I have no problem with you believing I don't trade - none whatsoever. It's even fine by me! It doesn't make any difference.

What does make a difference to me is whether, because of one man's little doubt, I give away to a huge trading board what represents a large enough sample size to quantitatively and statistically evaluate my trading style. I do over 100 trades per day many times. Do you realize that this is like dbphoenix posting three months worth of his trades, in all detail, here on this board? Would db do that? LOL! Would anybody on ET do???

To be quite honest, I am very willing to give away a lot of details, and things I've found to work, and anything you like. But if you think I give away for free long trading logs, so you can see (on a chart) exactly what I key off, what average #T discounts I use to enter, what stops and what usual average targets I use, then you're wrapped the wrong way.

With all due respect to Velocity_Trader, who posted an entire day's log in excel here on ET - A very noble deed, but I wouldn't have done it myself. He will now have a smaller or larger # of people shadowing him. He sure will have me. I have completely disseminated his log, evaluated and re-searched every single trade, entry and exit, in spreadsheet and on chart, and found lots of little tricks and advantages. I have assimilated techniques and made them part of myself. His style is now part of mine. He might have lost a little bit of 'edge'. How about if 10 traders do the same? Is something dawning on you by now? If you looked at how illiquid the DAX actually is, it sure should be.

Now, besides that, mind you, as much as I fully respect Velocity_Trader for his performance - He isn't dependent on trading. He is a broker's vice president, he makes a decent living either way. He makes more money on getting new traders than on anything. He doesn't have to worry so much about 'edge' in his own trading ventures. He will be happy for any new customer that comes in. Remember, every new customer he gets, copying his style, doing 100 turns per day on decent size, will mean cashflow for his company of another, maybe 20K a month or 250K a year, in what is comparatively "passive" income. He doesn't have to worry about his "edge". I am a private trader, I do. This is my only source of income. I want to keep it. Amen.

You've got to do your own work on this, Savant. It took me lots of work to figure it out. Lots of hand-drawing work on real charts, lots of due diligence, spreadsheets and calculation, which I still continue everyday. I don't just throw it away into some huge forum, so all the vultures and trolls can tear the advantages apart. You are dreaming man. Since you share your name with the most intelligent person in the world, this should make at least a little sense to you.

And finally, coming to my "believability" or "credibility" because I don't post logs or them being "proof" that I trade or don't: LOL this is the funniest thing I've heard in a while. What in hells name does that have to do with posting my logs here? This is typical troll logic. Electric, what century do you just live in? How about faking logs??? Anybody can fake an excel log (!), platform log, or even IB statement. My Photoshop and InDesign works again; Send me an IB statement and I'll do it up for you. Anybody with a graphics program and small collection of fonts can do it in a flash. I've done graphic design/DTP for years (still doing it), I can do it even faster.

So, your point of "proving" something via posted logs is complete and straight-out nonsense, since the only way to "prove" any performance would be to have fully Effron (or another big 5) *audited* accounts, and for these a link provided to that very archive on the accounting site. Until now, I see no reason to justify such expense. I tell you what, even under torture, I'd rather create a fake log and post it here than post a real one and reveal every core about my style. Are you seeing why your point is pointless?

But sure, if graphical (or even excel : LOL!) logs or statements are proof of performance for you - Good. It means there's still a lot to learn for you in this world. We all started off naiive at some point.

Thanks for playing, though. You lose.

Nevertheless, I appreciate your inquisitive nature, and your discussion with Jack is very interesting indeed.
I hope we can settle our differences for the coming year.

Have a Happy New Year!
Scientist.