The stricter the gun laws, the safer the children

Discussion in 'Politics' started by UsualName, Jul 17, 2019.

  1. You're just trolling now. NYC had the same gun laws in the 1970's when it had out of control crime under weak mayors. It has the same laws now that crime is again out of control under the current moron mayor.

    What did change was enforcement. Rudy G put in a zero tolerance policy for quality of life crimes, like subway turnstile jumpers and squeegee men. Turns out those same guys also committed a lot of more serious crime when no one was looking. He also established an aggressive stop and frisk program in high crime, ie black and PR, neighborhoods. That drove libs crazy and it is gone now and crime is back.
     
    #51     Jul 19, 2019
  2. This is like a person who used talcum powder and now is convinced it gave them cancer. Rational people require actual proof of causation. It's not clear to me how requiring a background check and FFL transfer red tape when a dad gives his son a shotgun will prevent suicides.

    These laws are not harmless either. In DC, which has draconian anti gun laws and a high murder rate, an army vet was prosecuted for a felony gun violation because he had a couple of empty shell casings in his pickup when he drove through the town. The law defines them as ammo, etc.

    From this discussion, it seems to me there would be a strong positive correlation between strict gun laws and high murder rates in cities. Chicago, NYC, DC, Baltimore. LA, Philly all have sky high murder rates and severe anti-gun laws. Maybe they should do a study on that.
     
    #52     Jul 19, 2019
    murray t turtle likes this.
  3. Tony Stark

    Tony Stark

    They get their guns from other states.Limiting access to guns has to come from the federal level like fully automatic weapens bans.

    https://www.usnews.com/news/best-st...nd-truths-about-chicagos-guns-and-murder-rate


    The Myths and Truths About Chicago's Guns and Murder Rate

    About 60 percent of illegal firearms seized and recovered by Chicago police come from out of state. They're traced back to states with less restrictive firearms regulations, with Indiana at the top of the list.


    The Associated Press

    BY SHARON COHEN, AP National Writer

    CHICAGO (AP) — Chicago police are wrestling with gun violence, blamed largely on gangs. President Donald Trump has frequently singled out the city for criticism , calling the crime problem "a total disaster" and claiming Chicago has the strongest guns laws in the nation and still hasn't been able to curb violence. But there are common misunderstandings about Chicago's homicide rate and how the city regulates firearms. Here are some of the myths and truths:

    ___

    IS CHICAGO THE NATION'S MURDER CAPITAL?

    No. This is a common misperception based partly on the national attention Chicago has attracted in recent years. The Pew Research Center reported in November that when adjusting for population, Chicago has recorded fewer murders per capita than many other smaller U.S. cities. Chicago ranked 14th among cities with at least 100,000 people in 2017. FBI statistics released this fall found St. Louis had the highest murder rate in 2017 — 66.1 homicides per 100,000 people. The Pew report said Chicago did have the highest actual number of homicides in the past few years. In 2016, there were 762 homicides. Last year, homicides dropped to 650. As of Dec. 6, there were 534.

    ___

    DOES CHICAGO HAVE THE TOUGHEST GUN LAWS IN THE NATION?

    No. Trump and his administration have wrongly made this assertion . Chicago passed a ban on handgun ownership in 1982. Those who'd already purchased and registered their handguns were allowed to keep them. In 2010, the ban was struck down by the U.S. Supreme Court, and in 2013, Illinois became the last state in the nation to approve concealed carry.

    Illinois is considered to have fairly tight gun laws. The state requires gun owners to obtain licenses and face background checks. It also imposes waiting periods on purchases. But unlike New York and California, Illinois, among other things, does not ban assault weapons or large-capacity magazines and does not require a state license for firearms dealers or one to sell ammunition, according to the Giffords Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence.

    This year, Gov. Bruce Rauner signed into law a measure allowing judges to take away weapons from people suffering mental health or other problems. He also extended a 72-hour waiting period to cover all gun purchases. But he vetoed legislation requiring the state licensing of firearms dealers, saying it would burden small businesses.


    WHAT ARE THE SOURCES OF ILLEGAL CHICAGO GUNS?

    According to the Trace Report, about 40 percent of illegally used or possessed firearms recovered in Chicago from 2013 to 2016 came from dealers in Illinois. The remaining 60 percent came from states with less regulation over firearms. Indiana accounted for about 1 in 5 of these weapons, followed by Mississippi and Wisconsin. The report says these trends have been consistent over the past decade. In the same time span, seven gun or sporting goods stores in Illinois were the top 10 source dealers of recovered weapons in Chicago. Three others were in Indiana.
     
    #53     Jul 19, 2019
    UsualName likes this.
  4. %%
    Exactly;
    + its worse than that.Too much power corrupts+ corrupts much. Ken Griffith /Citidel noted Chicago/Cook County ILL has the highest exit rate in the nation, noted too high taxes+ to much regulation................................................................................................... I've noticed a big pattern ;stupid infringement on 2nd ammendment seems to trend much stupid in other areas:caution::caution::caution::caution::caution::caution::caution: And noticed on your stats how much more motor vehicles cause deaths, than guns; auto violence is the big threat, not climate change.
     
    #54     Jul 19, 2019
  5. UsualName

    UsualName

    Please. Your entire argument is garbage and you just bounce around from unsound reason to unsound reason that have no basis in fact.

    This study confirms other studies that looked at the effects of gun laws on murders and suicides in the US. Add to those the comparable analysis of the US to other countries with gun control laws and it’s obvious you’re in denial and just can’t accept the truth.
     
    #55     Jul 19, 2019
    Tony Stark likes this.
  6. UsualName

    UsualName

    Exactly.
     
    #56     Jul 19, 2019
  7. UsualName

    UsualName

    If you actually had any interest in this area you would have already looked at all the steps NY took to become as safe as it is today. Don’t blame me for you being ignorant.
     
    #57     Jul 19, 2019
  8. UsualName

    UsualName

    Again, law enforcement is a big part of change. I don’t knock Rudy for his time as mayor. You got the wrong guy for that one.
     
    #58     Jul 19, 2019
  9. Tony Stark

    Tony Stark

    Unless you are a convicted felon or have a full auto weapon the punishment usually isn't that harsh,many get off with probation or a light sentence depending on the city, the persons record and their attorney.

    For convicted felons the punishment guideline is around 5 years and full auto is around 10 years

    In 2012 there were 84,173 convictions for illegally having a firearm.Of those 84,173 convictions only 5,768 convictions were already convicted felons.Virtually no one gets caught with fully automatic guns.

    So lets recap

    Non felon convictions which get the lightest sentences -78,000

    Convicted felon convictions which get a harsher sentence -5,768

    Full auto which get even harsher penalties even for non felons is virtually non existent.


    So harsher penalties do stop people from having illegal guns.
     
    #59     Jul 19, 2019
  10. Tsing Tao

    Tsing Tao

    No, I blame you for you being ignorant,.
     
    #60     Jul 22, 2019