The Polls - Is Trump Winning even without the Algo

Discussion in 'Politics' started by jem, Jul 27, 2016.

  1. jem

    jem

    that page says the final polls. As I told you before some of the final poll switched back to Obama.


    2. Ok so Trump was ahead then Clinton was up big. Were those polls wrong?
    the point I am making is that just because at some point in time the poll had one candidate ahead and that Candidate wins... does not mean those early polls are accurate or correct.

    Your whole thesis about calling polls good predictors is specious and proven to be so by the fact that you just pointed out Trump was ahead and now hillary may be.
     
    #351     Sep 21, 2016
  2. Tony Stark

    Tony Stark


    You said a week out,the polls posted were taken from the end of October .If a candidate takes a lead after being down for months it depends on how long it holds.Trump taking a one or two week lead does not negate a 2 month Hillary lead in The TS algo.In 2012 I didn't put Romney in the lead when he had his surge and I still have Hillary in the lead now even though Trump has had a good 2 weeks.If Trump wins most of the polls for around a month than I will start to worry.Trumps surge seems to be ending as Hillary is back to being ahead in most of the recent rcp polls.
     
    #352     Sep 21, 2016
  3. jem

    jem

    so they are only predicting when you feel they are predicting?

    you realize of course polls are asking who would you vote for if the election were held today.
    you realize that people change their minds, especially those in the middle.

    if you want predictions... have random people make bets on who they think the winners will be. And then see who the good predictors were over time and use that group.

    if you wish to take the current temperature... ask people who they would vote for if the election were today and use a good template.

    Polls are not predicting anything before the debates and maybe even after.

     
    #353     Sep 21, 2016
  4. Tony Stark

    Tony Stark

    You should realize that barring a very significant event very few people change their minds,especially in presidential elections.Even if they change their minds temporally they usually go back to their first choice.
     
    #354     Sep 21, 2016
  5. jem

    jem

    really... hilllary has not gone down and trump gone up lately significantly because people change their minds?

    it was just skewed polling?

     
    #355     Sep 21, 2016
  6. Tony Stark

    Tony Stark

    Romney had these same kind of short term raise in the polls, but voters voted for the one that most polls showed they would vote for.
     
    #356     Sep 21, 2016
  7. jem

    jem

    you are one stubborn democrat plant.
    that is some awesome disregard for logic right there.
    its not people changing their minds
    its not polls being wrong...
    its just what a temporary malfunction when polls don't predict the winner?
     
    #357     Sep 21, 2016
  8. Tony Stark

    Tony Stark

    Look at the polls as a whole jem.yes,the loser will get a few bumps but unless that lead is sastained over a long period it's likely just that,a short term bump.In this case Hillary is already coming back in the polls even after passing out and being dragged into a van.
     
    #358     Sep 21, 2016
  9. jem

    jem

    1. hillary is down 2 today in reuters 4 way poll today.
    So I don't see any bounce back in the polls.
    it was a plus 7 template which really down played independents in their template to only 14%.
    want to know why?

    They found that independents are now 39 for Trump 16 for Hillary.
    A week ago it was 31 for Trump 22 for Hillary.

    Hillary is completely toast if that holds up through election.
    She just got destroyed with independents since her weekend at Bernies and being dragged into the van.


    I hope you have now learned a few things from the Reuters Ipsos poll.

    1. People especially independents do change their minds during the months leading up to the election.

    2. Some polling companies manipulate their polls to make Hillary look as good as they can.

    3. Hillary is down big right now because she has lost of ton of independents for multiple reasons.

    4. Expect things to change



     
    #359     Sep 21, 2016
  10. jem

    jem

    and note on page 2 of the Economist You gov poll which has hillary in the lead by 2... it seems to have a 33 D 24 R 40 I template... and only 28 % is full time employed.

    and 20% of the people said they changed the mind about who they will vote for in the last 3 months.
     
    #360     Sep 21, 2016