Huios, Im following your evolution and learn a lott from you and all supportive feedback you receive. I'm no veteran trader yet. I have still a lott of howework to complete. I just have one question which might be of some value for your quest: "How do you want the tape volume and price to behave at the s/r just prior to your entry?" Regards, Sharktooth
7 trades, 3 wins, 3 losses, 1 b/e for +2.25 pts. My biggest problem is I am not taking my trades. My biggest problem is I am not taking my trades. My biggest problem is I am not taking my trades. My biggest problem is I am not taking my trades. Net for the day: +78.90 Net for the week: -129.70 Net for the month: -525.80 Going out to dinner. Chinese!!! I can live on chinese food, peanut butter, water, and orange juice, and live happily ever after. OK, an occasional cup of coffee.
08/20 was kind of an NR7, but 08/21 was a strange zigzag day... Of course, I can't argue with LBR blablabla, but I guess NR7 stuff just didn't pan out today eh?
Dizzyspell, Not to chase this rabbit too far since it's H's thread but the expose' might help shed new light for the journey. So some questions for you about the use of price as the only indicator. Do you watch a chart or quotes? If chart; then what timeframe? Maybe just numbers in time & sales format? Are you making decisions based on specific behaviors of price action? Patterns? Sudden increase in price movement? What, how, and in what manner does price speak to tell you about the many decisions to make? You're probably at the expert level (unconscious competent?) which is like driving to a destination and realizing you made it safely but don't remember exactly how you got there. You remind yourself you must know enough of what to do and do it correctly since you did make it and did so in one piece. I suspect that your successful trading off of price only comes from a level of experience that may be hard to define in specifics unless you already happen to have everything spelled out in detail. Because if price tells all then there must be lots to tell since there are so many decisions to make when trading and so many variations in price movement behavior. Yes I know, KISS; get in - get out. But.... At bare minimum you need two decisions; entry and exit, yet each has sub-components. For entry you have to decide to go long or short. That means a directional signal of sorts. If it's 50-50 do you use a coin toss or does price provide any clue as to the edge to make it 51-49 or better? Surely there must be some type of setup that helps in deciding the trade direction? What is it about price alone (maybe in relation to price itself?) that flips the switch to either up or down? Ok, so now you're in the trade no matter how you got there - the easy part's done. At a minimum Exits are split into two categories; Losses and Profits. (A third category is breakeven if anyone wants to be technical about it). Now price has to tell you when to get out. Loss exits should be easy and predefined. Of course there's the issue of how to set the loss amount, %, or whatever but that's a whole discussion unto itself. Last is the toughest of all - when to take the profit. And without even broaching the subject of scaling in and/or out of multiple contracts there's the topic of re-entry! Which may or may not be based on criteria different than the original entry signal. So, although your only item used to make decisions by is price and price alone, the decision making process entails the same elements. AND, all the conditions (consciously or unconsciously) that are generated by price "behaviors" somehow help you to pull the trigger to enter and to exit. No wonder combining "other" indicators adds additional complexities by creating instances of further decision making refinements. Just looking at different price movement behavior in relation to a single moving average creates all sorts of new relationship possibilities. Now the logical mind must dissect each element and try and attach meaning to each condition! It's enough to drive the logical mind mad! - especially when ANYTHING can and will happen that defies what might logically be expected next! I agree that price is King. It's what determines the valuation of your trade so it's direct and known. Most everything is a secondary derivative of price that interprets price movement behavior. I keep saying "price movement behavior" because a single price by itself tells us nothing. But price related to previous price(s) establishes certain "behavioral" patterns that repeat. If recognition of that behavior becomes "second nature" to the one trading and that trader is "tuned in" to the price movement behavior then trading is a matter of executing from internal confidence of one's execution ability coupled with an infallible capacity to admit when a trade isn't working without regret for taking a loss. Does this in some way describe your approach to trading? Trying to get there myself.
Futuresnut, Your description of my way of trading is probably right but I don't look into that much. I have posted charts here before and apart from a few traders the comments are all negative because I use close stops. Human nature is the killer of most traders. People can't except something can be simple, they have to complicate it. For example a setup will occur with a system but before they take the trade someone has told them about some you beaut indicator that may help confirm the trade. Before you know it there are lines and indicators all over the place. and in the end the trade is not taken because confusion reigns. I use simple price pattern setups on the chart eg d/bottoms, fibb ret etc. If two or more happen at the same time I take the trade. I use a close stop. If it doesn't work I am out of there with no pain. I have explained this before here and I have said enough. I don't use any ma's s/r lines rsi's, trendlines etc. If I get a double top at a .618 ret whammo I take the trade. 90% of traders lose and they are the ones that make it difficult. Take Huios for example and no disrespect for him but his mind is totally confused with so many different things. If he looked at one thing it would train his mind to take the signal and not miss trades which is what he is doing. I believe this site can only damage him as a trader because there are two many opinions. If he takes something from all of them he will be so confused he won't be able to trade well. I wish him all the best. It sounds to me like he was a better trader before he started this thread. Last statement KISS. KISS. Keep it simple stupid. Its a 50/50 game with no matter how many indicators you use. Close stops will save you. Good trading.
i can feel what you are thinking.. its the same for me. i put on and tried serveral indicators over and over, but...at least...i have to admitt, they dont tell me anything beyond the plain price action...there are pattern, yes, but you never know, when they work out and when not. getting the piont, why it is so important to consistently execute the setups you believe in... trading
Hey Dizman, No disrespect taken at all. And I concurr, my trading has gotten way to complicated, at I stated yesterday. Yesterday my trading was "easier" than it has since I've come back to real $$$, was it the larger swings, larger overall range (20 pt range vs. 12 pt range), less stuff on the charts, or was it something as simple as edifying music in the background to keep me grounded. Missed trades are kicking my butt, gonna try a minor twist today. Rock and Roll. H
One thing I have learned for certain over the last couple of years is that there is an infinite number of ways to trade. I seriously doubt any two traders trade exactly the same way. Some people use lots of indicators, some dont. Complicated people use complicated systems, simple people use simple systems.