. Libertad wrote: With all due respect....large currency transitions mean the acceptance by many differing societies a common resolve...void of local solutions... No blanket approach will resolve a cadre of countries issues... These countries must resolve most of their internal problems before any blanket approach can be applied... Otherwise...what lies beneath the blanket will always be the same... And true ethnicity will always be an issue...not resolvable...and naturally correct....there is nothing to resolve... One country will never pawn off its problems on the other one for very long...The ethnic society or the payee will not continue once they catch on to who is really paying.... The basic math of supposed total currency relative value movement is incorrect...thus the total hypothesis above is flawed... ********* SouthAmerica: Reply to Libertad What are you suggesting? That the Europeans should cancel the âEuroâ? And all European countries should return to their original currencies? . ****************** South America: Reply to Jficquette There are two different issues going on in Europe 1) Monetary = Euro 2) Political = Constitution The Euro is a success, and it is here to stay. The constitution issue will take a little longer to be resolved, but in due time Europe will have its constitution. The French and the Dutch were right in turning down the ridiculous document that they created. They should go back to the drawing board. This constitution is a huge book, and most people donât understand what is inside that book. (Something similar to the US Tax code) I donât know why they donât adopt a simple constitution; something similar to the US Constitution. In my opinion, the US Constitution is a âMasterpiece.â All you need is the US Constitution, with few new amendments such as to protect free speech in the internet, free speech in the satellite transmissions, free speech on any new technology developed in the future. And another 5 or 6 amendments to protect a few things that still need constitutional protection. The US Constitution is an outstanding document, and you can fit it on your back pocket. I understand that in England, they have Euro cash machines to help tourists with their money needs. It is a mater of time for the Brits to adopt the Euro. .
Creating a Euro zone should be done like creating a business. You start small, let the first company mature. Once this is achieved you can slowly and carefully try to grow. Europe wanted to become the biggest economical zone of the world overnight. They added new members at a crazy rate without monitoring the effect of them on the whole group. Germany got financially heavyly hit with when East Germany joined. And all the problems of the new members couldn't be absorbed anymore by the others because the new members were those who had problems and hoped that the financially strong members would solve their problems. It was like creating a group that is financially very strong: you take some billionaires and add all the tramps you can find within a range of 1000 miles. Than you ask the billionaires to give everybody a good live. All the tramps do is collecting the money from the wealthy members and all the billionaires do is pay. And the politicians got their part as well because a new institution was created where they could share huge salaries for doing almost nothing at all. It is only important to get in this select group. And than everybody wonders why people vote NO? It is clear that the politicians want to save Europe, i would do the same if i got such a salary.
EU is going to solve this problem in Brazil? I think not. http://www.marketwatch.com/news/sto...s&guid={EF682C7E-5DBF-46FE-8B1C-4C9C45D74DD1}
msfe wrote: 06-05-05 03:40 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote from libertad: The EURO concept works well in theory...but any sort of collective approach such as this is doomed to fail.... It is failing as we speak: These countries will exit...and soon will use their own currencies again...and sooner than you think... Italy France Germany Switzerland Holland -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Switzerland is first ... never joined the Euro zone ................................................................................. Thank you.. Correction: Netherlands
South America...... Excellent Commentary..... You certainly have good ideas and work hard on them obviously... I have work...living...and banking experience in Latin America and the United States... You asked if I would eliminate the EURO as such..... Specifically...if you are for the ease of big business to operate at the expense of what would be the equivalent of the middle class in most countries...then you would think that it would be ok to put on large legal blanket approaches such as the EURO...CAFTA...NAFTA....etc... The multiplier effect of losing this and the next generations agriculture...moderate size businesses...which really are the mainstay of any country...is indeed sociologically and economically unacceptable to these people who in turn make up more than 50% of the population on average... The broadening of big business snuff´s out forever...the crazy cowboys that wake up in the morning and go to sleep at night thinking that they can overcome their daily obstacles against the big boys... Remember...the US economy is what it is because of foolish cowboys.... Just like the stock market...a healthy market is one that has lots of money ...both stupid and smart... ................................................................................... What I am trying to say is that although in theory some ideas are better economically....does not mean that you should put them in place.... What is better than the EURO.....is indeed for each country to have their own sovereignty and indeed to print their own money... Printing money..playing with interest rates...and making your own rules with respect to your own domestic issues gives the country more possible solutions when used properly... If they are not using them properly ,,,they will of course pay for their mistakes one way or another....but their mistakes should not be piled up on someone else... Sorry man...but big government big concept thinking is not better in my book...
The EU is sort of a cartel. Cartels have a history of not lasting, 13 years being about the record or so I am told. NAFTA has a better chance because it is going beyond an agreement and is more of a merging of cultures, visit Southern California some time. Californian businesses have had manufacturing in Mexico for decades for the cheap labor and relaxed environmental standards, now Mexicans are living and working in the USA, and they celebrate Cinco De Mayo and keep as much of their culture as they want to. That will work, cartels lilke the EU or OPEC or whatever, they fall apart pretty fast though I must admit I like the EU's approach to environmental laws and manufacturing quality.
Why won't you Brazilians simply choose GOLD, which has been proven as the best possible money over thousands of years, instead of the new and untested, slowly imploding and inflating, politically manipulated paper currency? (call it euro, dollar, or real - makes no difference) The same question could of course be asked from us Europeans as well.
. SouthAmerica; Reply to Traderlivermore You always will have some kind of political crisis because of corruption. Corruption is part of the capitalist system. Savings & loans crisis 1980âs, Enron, WorldCom, and so onâ¦â¦ ************* Quote from libertad: The EURO concept works well in theory...but any sort of collective approach such as this is doomed to fail.... It is failing as we speak: These countries will exit...and soon will use their own currencies again...and sooner than you think... Italy France Germany Switzerland Holland SouthAmerica: The Euro is not failing. The Euro is here to stay. Since the Americans are running this massive deficit spending, and the US dollar is heading south â The Europeans are trying to make their currency weaker by trying to talk it down. But in reality â in the near future the US dollar will continue the declining trend against the Euro. **************** SouthAmerica: Reply to Spike 500 They have been building the new Europe over a long period of time. They started with the European common Market decades ago. The Euro was just one more step in the development of the new Europe. The fundamentals of the new Europe are solid, and will continue to improve in the future. Euro has a net positive balance of trade with the rest of the world. The Euro has a lot of assets â reserves and gold â to back up the value of the new currency. The new Europe and the Euro are in better shape financially than the US and the US dollar. You said: âAnd than everybody wonders why people vote NO?â The French said ânoâ because of a number of reasons, but one of the major reasons is that they donât want to privatize government companies. *************** Libertad: I have work...living...and banking experience in Latin America and the United States... You asked if I would eliminate the EURO as such..... Specifically...if you are for the ease of big business to operate at the expense of what would be the equivalent of the middle class in most countries...then you would think that it would be ok to put on large legal blanket approaches such as the EURO...CAFTA...NAFTA....etc... The multiplier effect of losing this and the next generations agriculture...moderate size businesses...which really are the mainstay of any country...is indeed sociologically and economically unacceptable to these people who in turn make up more than 50% of the population on average... The broadening of big business snuff´s out forever...the crazy cowboys that wake up in the morning and go to sleep at night thinking that they can overcome their daily obstacles against the big boys... Remember...the US economy is what it is because of foolish cowboys.... Just like the stock market...a healthy market is one that has lots of money ...both stupid and smart... ................................................................................... What I am trying to say is that although in theory some ideas are better economically....does not mean that you should put them in place.... What is better than the EURO.....is indeed for each country to have their own sovereignty and indeed to print their own money... Printing money..playing with interest rates...and making your own rules with respect to your own domestic issues gives the country more possible solutions when used properly... If they are not using them properly ,,,they will of course pay for their mistakes one way or another....but their mistakes should not be piled up on someone else... Sorry man...but big government big concept thinking is not better in my book... *************** SouthAmerica: No. I am not in favor of hurting the middle class. I am in favor of building the middle class as much as possible. A solid middle class forms the foundations for a successful capitalist society. You are mixing apples and oranges here when you said: âlarge legal blanket approaches such as the EURO...CAFTA...NAFTA....etc..â Today we have a complete different ball game regarding international currencies. The amount of money that moves around the world at the speed of light it is mind-boggling. There is too much hot money just moving around looking for a quick return, and this money destabilize the long term stability of many nations. I worked as a controller for various international trading companies, and we lost a lot of trading opportunities because of currency. The international speculators can kill the entire Brazilian economy if they decide to kill the Brazilian Real. The Brazilian government doesnât have enough reserves to defend the Real if the big boys decide to go after that currency. Brazil has lost many sound companies that ended up out of business because of the weak currency, and not because of the quality of the product, and everything else. The Argentina government was put out of business because of the currency game. California did not go out of business like Argentina only because California has the US dollar. As I mentioned before, I have to do some further thinking on the subject, but today looks to me like it is time to create a 3rd large currency called the âGlobalâ and Brazil, China, India, and Russia should adopt this new currency as soon as possible. As I mentioned before, the United States does much better by having one currency instead of California, New York, and Texas each state having its own currency. The national currency policy in Washington doesnât always agree with the individual needs of each state in the US economy. If Brazil were part of the Euro today, interest rates in Brazil would be less than 5 percent, instead of the current 19.75 percent. If Brazil had adopted the Euro 5 years ago, then today the Brazilian GNP would have twice as large. .