The Angle Group

Discussion in 'Professional Trading' started by jpd307, Oct 9, 2009.

  1. jpd307


    I recently applied to a trader position with The Angle Group. They emailed me back so I was trying to do some research on the company but I am not have much luck finding anything.

    Does anyone know anything about these guys?

    Also in their email it mentioned a training program that some people would be put through and if they passed they would go trade for their fund called Hawkeye. I cant find anything on this fund either. Sounds a little sketchy too me.

    Any help is appreciated.

  2. jpd307



    Anybody even heard of these guys?
  3. CET


    No, I have not seen anything on this group, but I feel certain they have an Angle they are playing. :eek:
  4. jpd307


    I talked to someone at the firm yesterday. He said if I was selected to become a trader I would join the firm and participate in the training program (which costs ($5,000 by the way). Once through the training I would become a trader for them. He didn't mention really any details about what happens once I actually become a trader so it still is raising red flags.

    Does anyone else have any experience with this format or company?
  5. I don't know anything about the company, don't care, don't want to get into a conversation about them.

    But if they are charging you $5K for their "training program", most likely it's just a prop shop looking to run you through their trading mill.

    You may succeed, or you may fail, but they are still going to get their money.


    Trading requires a lot of independence, work and disicpline to succeed at, there are no free rides or lunches, just suckers getting taken for the money.
  6. spinn


    dont reputable employers usually pay you?

    I would run from anyone asking $5k for training.............
  7. jpd307


    That was my general though but that is why I am here checking. If this could be a normal procedure then I might be more open to it but otherwise it just seems suspect.
  8. I received the same offer and went in and spoke with their traders. I am currently trading at a different prop firm so I know what the game is all about. I asked a few questions. 1. Is there any chance that after i give you 5k I will never get to trade live? Answer: It has never happened but if they decided that while trading demo that they would be unwilling to let you trade firm capital, they would refund you the 5k. 2. How long before I start trading live? Answer: typically 4-8 weeks, with 12 weeks being the longest of anyone going through the trading program. 3. Once I go live, is there any possibility that you will no longer let me trade firm capital? Answer: The worst that would happen is they would cut you down to 100 share lots, unless you did something tremendously irresponsible and cost the firm an outrageous amount of money. It has never happened. 4. What is the payout? Answer: 60% to the trader, 40% to the firm, with the opportunity to retain earnings and buy out your remaining equity. 5. What platform do you use? Answer: Lightspeed. 6. What is the general trading methedology? Answer: Relative Strength/Weakness vs futures on high volume, high beta names.

    Anyway, I'm not vouching for any of the answers, just relating what i was told by 2 of the managing partners. To be honest I'm considering moving there b/c at my current firm they have 25% of me and losses are on me. My understanding is that although they claim you are paying for training, you are actually just putting up capital to provide a cushion to them on losses you might assume while climbing the learning curve. All these shops require a bit of a leap of faith, and if they can truly teach you how to trade RS/RW, the 5k capital contribution is a drop in the bucket, you'll make it back in a day at some point. I too am having a hard time finding info about the firm though, so anyone with more insight, please share.
  9. also, i don't know of any prop firm that pays a salary. And if they did, it would just be a draw off of future earnings. It's difficult even to find a place without a capital contribution. Traders who get paid salaries either have established track records or work an execution desk on an agency basis, which is a bit different than trading prop. If anyone knows of a trading firm that will pay salary to unestablished traders, please post.
  10. jpd307


    this was a list posted on this site a while ago of salary paying trading firms.

    Spot Trading (prop trading pays a salary, upstairs)
    Jump Trading (prop trading pays a salary, upstairs)
    Infinium Capital (CBOE equity, index, CME financial & ag, on floor & upstairs)
    Wolverine (CBOE equity & index market making, CME, on floor & upstairs)
    Group One (CBOE equity market making, on floor)
    Jane Street Capital (does equity market making as well as pairs trades / they allege "stat arb" wrongly, on floor & upstairs)
    Ronin (market making w/ some prop mixed in I think, not positive they start you on a salary that but I believe so, on floor & upstairs)
    Belvedere (SPX, OEX market making, on floor)
    Transmarket (CME fixed income market making, upstairs)
    Susquehanna (CBOE equity market making, ETF market making, on floor & upstairs)
    IMC (CBOE equity & index market making on floor & upstairs)
    Optiver (CBOE equity & index market making all upstairs)
    Peak6 (CBOE equity market making all upstairs)
    Chicago Trading Co. (CBOE & CME equity & index market making on floor & upstairs)
    Liquid Capital (US & UK, in US, CBOE & CME index market making on floor & upstairs)
    Blue Capital (CBOE SPX, RUT, OEX market making on floor, some upstairs prop, not sure if they are hiring new guys)
    KC Co II (CME index market making on floor & upstairs, again not sure they are hiring new guys)
    Everest (CBOE equity mm on floor, no web-site that I know of)
    Knight Capital (don't know how many are sales-traders v. market makers, upstairs)
    Bear Wagner (NYSE specialist)
    Oscar Gruss & Son (same)
    GFI (again sales trading mostly, but know some guys do executions, upstairs)
    First New York (prop gig no MM, but pays a salary, upstairs)

    I think a lot of them are in Chicago though.
    #10     Oct 31, 2009