The American Dream Is Dead

Discussion in 'Politics' started by dbphoenix, Oct 24, 2014.

  1. k p

    k p

    Ah.. finally a thread to get into without... great for a distraction from trading!

    1. I have to say, my feeling from what I see is that getting ahead financially these days in the west is becoming the same as trying to get ahead if you're in some poor Asian country... there are just too many factors out of your control. It may be logically attainable, but practically very much out of reach for enough people to make this statistically significant.

    Its like this. If you want a good view to look at from your condo, its simple, just buy a penthouse. But how many of these actually exist? For every gorgeous penthouse view, there will be hundreds of crappy units below that have to be build to support that penthouse up so high.

    If everyone actually went to university, and I perhaps think more people go today than ever before, then all this does is diminish the value of university which is what we see today. Too many grads, nothing for them to do.

    Just like with penthouses, there are only so many "top" spots in the world. The trick is, how do we make life for the guys in the middle and at the bottom. When we build condo buildings so close together that everyone, unless the guy on the top, has a shitty view, then you get what we have today. We have a world where only the top can benefit, and everyone below is supporting the guys at the top, contributing to them, but not to themselves. The way to make this more fair is to realize that most middle and lower class citizens still make a good contribution to the world that needs to be recognized with a decent wage and opportunity.

    Not everyone can be a doctor, lawyer or engineer. So what are the rest of us to do... roll over and die? Does the majority not deserve stable income, good housing, enough food and a secure retirement? Of course the problem is that those in power, controlled by those with all the big bucks, want to take more and more, and we let them. My feeling is that this is precisely because as things were getting harder and harder, the middle class had less and less time to devote to politics, to making sure they were being fairly represented. Now of course its far too late, until I guess a major reset, whatever that will be.

    So since this is in response to your post DOH, I'd like know what, what is the majority to do? Its easy to say get an education, which is fine if you're mentoring your own kid, but if you're supposed to govern a state or country, you can surely see that not everyone can have a degree and a high paying job. So do you tell everyone else their job is to work hard for nothing to serve the needs of the few? How do you balance things out? I'm just sick of this "get more education" response.

    3. I find it funny that telling people to spend wisely is offered as a suggestion. Can you imagine if everyone saved more? Lets call it 5%, just 5%. If every poor person skipped one MacDonald's meal, one trip to Walmart, rented one less movie, or downloaded on less app. The bottom line of most corporations would drop 5%! This would cause stocks to plummet.... retirement funds to collapse, government tax revenue to greatly miss the mark followed by major cuts and then of course this all snowballs! So I find this suggestion funny because if poor people could actually organize enough to do this, those with all the assets would pay a much much higher price. This will of course never happen, but its funny that this is your advice because once again, on a larger scale, this would be disastrous to the entitled. Its great advice to the individual, we all know people who buy shit they don't need or will ever use, but in the general sense, the economy could not survive is everyone got smart.

    4. Balancing work and study is extremely hard. Its difficult to focus, and once again, only those with rich parents who have all the resources can have an education that is unencumbered by so many distractions. On top of this, the idea that finishing will actually get you somewhere is a crap shoot these days because the debt is guaranteed but the job isn't, so this makes it even harder to focus. Once again, you say get a scholarship, but how many qualify and how many are out there? If its less than 10%, don't even use this as a solution. This doesn't help the majority.

    All your examples illustrate examples that help only a few, but do nothing to the health of a nation. Maybe this advice is great for your kids, but as a leader, as a public figure whose job it is to help your community, your ideas would be ineffective.
     
    #51     Oct 24, 2014
  2. wildchild

    wildchild

    Why are you against affordable food?

    Secondly, there is no such thing as the obese poor. It does not exist.
     
    #52     Oct 25, 2014
  3. I guess all these fat f%^ks we see waddling around the ghettos are fake then? Could it be that it's caused by fake food? Personally I'm all for entrepreneurial stuff but presenting that McDonalds garbage as food and including addicting chemicals in it is more like what I'd do were I trapping animals.
     
    #53     Oct 25, 2014
  4. The American Dream is Alive and Doing Very Well (for winners)

    This is the market right here in your post. What makes a failure trader. Deconstruct your attitudes and learn from them.

    You are crying out for personal achievement. This is what you want and what you fear you cannot have. So everything becomes a distraction from why you don't have what you want. Trading is a distraction from perceived shortcomings in life, and now ruminating about inequality in the world is a distraction from failure in trading. If only there were opportunities for everyone...for people like you.

    On some level you know what you want: you focus on it. The penthouse. Yet your ego needs a reason why you are not living in it - so you say its the 1% keeping you down and hogging the opportunity. For as long as you think like this, you can justify not taking action. As long as you think like this, you are easy prey for those selling distraction and aspiration. ("luxury" goods bought with debt, fast food, reality TV, gambling, cheap affairs, get rich quick trading schemes, alcohol consumption, spectator sports, etc)

    Hold yourself accountable, get educated, take action. Internet is an amazing resource and provides a wonderful opportunity to be exposed to interesting people and a variety of ideas. Throw off the negative beliefs about yourself and ignore the worlds problems. You are no use to anyone until you have made the best of yourself first. If you can't solve your own personal problems how can you help a community or a nation? In striving to improve self, you will be a benevolent influence and set an example to others.

    Waiting for a politician to appear in the third act (lowered from a crane?) and solve the worlds problems is not productive; neither is wasting time pondering the magic words he would speak (hope? change?) and what form the solution to the human condition would take. Focus on yourself - what you can control - YOUR thoughts, beliefs, actions. If everyone took personal responsibility and helped the less fortunate in their own families and communities there would be little need for government to do much beyond providing military, police, and courts. So practice industry, honesty, frugality, and charity in your own life.

    You've pissed away a year and $3,500 on a delusional get rich quick scheme. You could have been making micro loans or starting a small business (window cleaning service, van hire, gardening?). There are people making money online - drop shipping, affiliate marketing, etc. You could still get out there and hustle. $3,500 buys you a 1 way ticket and 3 months living expenses in Thailand. Your most precious resource is TIME. Use it wisely.

    Find something you can be excellent at, turn it into a business. Until you know exactly what that is, preserve your capital. If you can get out now without wasting more time and money you have done better than most and learned your lesson. If you can work out why and how you were suckered in you may have insight for a lifetime. If you understand why people buy there is a bright future for you in sales! What did you buy into and why?

    Your question of what must be done for the poor and average people was answered in antiquity - look up the Melian dialogue. There is room at the top for those who can earn their place. Build your own penthouse on top of the units you've provided for others to live. Make their interests align with yours. Offer value. Simple.

    Remember that you will die. I can guarantee that when your life is near its end you will not be wishing you had spent more time learning how to "properly" draw a trendline. Are you living the life you really want, or are you being kept in fear and under control? What are you going to do about it?

    Since you are somebody who wants or needs to be given a recipe to follow, try this:
    #1. Abandon trading. No more visiting ET. Close our your brokerage accounts. Be grateful to receive money that would otherwise have been lost.
    #2. Introspect until you identify the need you were trying to satisfy with trading. (this may not be purely financial)
    #3. Find 50 examples of people who have made money on the Internet and how. (e.g. affiliate marketing, drop shipping, ebooks, web design or programming)
    #4. Find 50 examples of small businesses you could start, not necessarily Internet based (e.g. landscape gardening, removals, window cleaning, cake decorating, personal trainer, motivational speaker, etc)
    #5. Learn more about yourself and what interests you. How can you meet the need you identified in #2? Try to imagine yourself involved in any of these businesses.Try stuff out. Ditch what you don't like quickly. Move on.
    #6. Found an idea to start a serious business? Great, get cracking. Else GOTO #3.
    #7. Pay it forward. Use your knowledge and experience to help someone else achieve a goal in their life.

    You've got persistence...which will carry you so far. Use failure in trading as motivation to succeed in your next business. Persistence applied too long to a futile goal will leave you exhausted, broken, bitter, disappointed, and resigned to mediocrity. Learn to direct your efforts more wisely. I don't want to visit ET in 6 months and see that you have become an expert in predicting the past and have another 500 posts to your name. ;-)

    Maybe this isn't for you. Maybe you need somebody to guide you (read tell you what to do). That is called being employee. There is nothing wrong with that, yet with very few exceptions you don't get the penthouse. The world needs good followers the same as it needs good leaders. Seek to know yourself.
     
    #54     Oct 25, 2014
  5. They're full of them,
    in the South.
     
    #55     Oct 25, 2014
  6. k p

    k p

    Oh Blotto... I almost want to say that I've missed you, but you haven't left me alone long enough for me to actually say that! :D

    You do make excellent points, that I will give you, but I think you have me figured out all wrong. First of all, why do you keep insisting that I cannot make this work? You are here everyday, you claim to make so much money, so if you can do it, why can't I? I do have lots of problems with how the world works today, and by learning to trade, I can actually get one step ahead and make money regardless of all the problems in the world.

    I'm not crying out for someone to save me, I am simply sharing what I think and how I feel as accurately as I can so that those reading, who are inclined to help, are better able to do so because they have a more accurate account of where I am at and what I need. Although trading is a personal journal, starting and being pointed in the right direction by others is a good beginning. There is no point in re-inventing the wheel as ND had said before. Saying that, given how overwhelmed I have been this week, I do absolutely need to spend less time posting and more time studying myself, but sorry, I'm not going to be posting less because I've given up, I'm going to be posting less because I'm working harder.

    I could ask you why you care so much about making sure I quit trading, but frankly, I really don't care about your answer. I'm not sure how you found this thread, perhaps you are stalking me or Db. I do read some of Db's posts, so this is how I found this thread, but how did you?

    Seriously, for weeks now, your only goal has been to make sure I stop trading... why are you so invested in making sure I give up? How can you call this a delusional get rich quick scheme when you claim to be some expert trader? Perhaps its the "quick" part that is the bitch... this I can see, but at least your argument might have more weight for you if you in fact were a failed trader and only knew failed traders and hence were convinced that nobody made money trading. But since you claim to be so good, why do you assume that I can't get there? If its because I am using trendlines and price action, then your arguments are against my method and not me. If you are convinced that I can't get there because of some current psychological profile, then I say this can be changed with calming the fear by doing my own analysis.

    I'm flattered you would spend so much of your brain power to "figure" me out, and as I opened, you do make excellent points, but you've made a few miscalculations and have arrived at the wrong conclusion.

    EDIT: By being my biggest critic, I think you have inadvertently become my biggest fan. Thanks!
     
    #56     Oct 25, 2014
  7. dbphoenix

    dbphoenix

    Chart: You're Working More But Earning Less
    —By Dave Gilson

    | Fri Sep. 26, 2014 6:00 AM EDT

    We'll be posting a new chart on the current state of income inequality every day for the next couple of weeks. Yesterday's chart looked at the history of the 1 percent, from ancient Rome to today.

    Today, another look at how middle-class incomes have been stuck in neutral while the rest of the economy has grown. In 2012, the median household income (adjusted for inflation) was the same as it was in 1996.

    [​IMG]
     
    #57     Oct 25, 2014
  8. Lucrum

    Lucrum

    Mother Jones, really?

    LOL
     
    #58     Oct 25, 2014
  9. wildchild

    wildchild

    They are not poor. The obese poor do not exist. Secondly what does McDonalds have to do with it. Take some responsibility for what you put into your body and stop blaming someone else. Of course democrats don't believe in that.
     
    #59     Oct 25, 2014
  10. jem

    jem

    So should we level more taxes on the the 99% or eliminate them?

    Should we allow the Federal Reserve to dilute the buying power of the dollar by continuing to create trillions of dollars without it even being monitored.... or should we monitor them.

    Should we make many working families pay 2000 to 4000 dollars more per year for more limited health care or should we have them pay less.

    Should we have single payer or Obama and the Dems insurance company care?
    Should we have death taxes on the 99%?
    Should we have progressive taxes when we have this much inflation on the 99%.








     
    #60     Oct 25, 2014