Discussion in 'Index Futures' started by AICN, Oct 21, 2002.

  1. Quah


    The tax rules are totally different when it comes to futures. Your "trader" status doesn't have any effect on futures and their taxes.

    The deductable limits are totally different - the $3000 rule does not apply - in fact, if you have a lot of losses this year you can file amended returns for previous years and deduct the losses from those years (assuming they were profitable).

    Section 1256 contracts fall under totally different rules. Just look on the IRS website, it is very simple, far simpler than equities.
    #11     Oct 21, 2002
  2. No,that's wrong. You're confusing trader status with mtm.
    Trader status: Futures gains and losses are 60/40 cap. Expenses are deducted on sched C

    MTM, if you elect mtm by 4/15 of current year, you can reduce ordinary income by the amount of your loss. (I think it's the amount of your loss), so if you are a full time trader with mtm, where's the ordinary income gonna come from?

    No mtm (with or without trader status), losses are 40 short, 60% long, and get treated like anybody else, $3000 per year
    #12     Oct 21, 2002
  3. Yeah, I could be wrong about the 3000 per year. Quah is probably right, but trader status won't help you with capital losses (just expenses) and it's too late for mtm. (elect mtm if you think on or before 4/15 you will have a losing year!?!?!)
    #13     Oct 21, 2002
  4. yeah, that's right as I understand it, I think I was typing instead of reading. (I'm so excited, I'm finally starting to understand taxes.) Ask me anything anything at all, and I will go to IRS PUB 550 and find it for you.
    #14     Oct 21, 2002
  5. Quah


    Section 1256 contracts are already MTM. You don't have to elect that. In fact, electings MTM has no effect on Section 1256 contracts as far as I know.
    #15     Oct 21, 2002
  6. I was referring to stocks, not futures.

    It is such a damnable mess this whole thing. As for other types of income, my wife works and we also have interest income so that's what I meant by ordinary income.
    #16     Oct 21, 2002
  7. Quah


    It is most certainly a mess.

    However, I find the rule about futures contracts/trading to be pretty easy - especially vs. equities/options.
    #17     Oct 21, 2002
  8. Yeah quah, it does. If you elect mtm, you lose the 60/40 split. Cap losses are converted to ordinary losses. Now, you can elect mtm for stocks but not futures.
    #18     Oct 21, 2002
  9. Quah


    Are you saying it you elect MTM (which you can only do for stocks) you loses the 60/40 split on the 1256 contracts?
    #19     Oct 21, 2002
  10. Tell me about it. I was over at, and they have an expert, but the lady writing the article got mtm all mixed up.

    I only started researching it because I never even heard of electing mtm. As Quah states, all futures are marked to market anyway, but electing mtm is a whole nuther thing.
    #20     Oct 21, 2002