No time to read the entire thread but two quick comments: 1. You WISH and hope you are in the situation where you have to pay estimated taxes. 2. You first interest bill/penalty from the IRS or state/local revenue collector will surely change your mind.
The obvious solution is to replace the income and capital gains taxes with a national sales tax. This would have numerous benefits including . . . Taking away the power of Congress to implement social engineering. Elimination of the IRS gestapo. Elimination of the billions spent on trying to comply with the 50,000 page tax code. Boost the economy by allowing citizens to keep THEIR money (which they will no doubt spend with abandon). Encourage savings and discourage consumption (they'll spend it anyway - hehe). Get rid of the whole deduction system so people make their financial decisions on the actual merits. While we're at it, we should eliminate the Social Security tax (like you're ever gonna see that again). Perhaps people should then be forced to contribute a like amount to an interest bearing account with THEIR name on it. They would be miles ahead!! Better yet, screw the people that refuse to be responsible with their money and save for their retirement. If they won't take responsibility, why should we have to? Bottom line, keep voting Democrat, Republican or Green and you can forget about eliminating the income tax. Vote Libertarian! BTW, I had to pay $170,000 in taxes a couple years ago when I sold my business. My big tax rebate under Dubya - $300. I could go on (OK, I will) . . . We should spend the next 10 years downsizing the freaking government. Just let us keep our money and take care of our own familes. We should bring the military home, cut their budget in half and give them the sole job of protecting the borders of the continental US. We can take the savings and send every kid in the country to college for free. We should immediately halt all immigration into the US. There's too damn many people here already. We should search out all illegal immigrants and send them packing. We should take the best people from NASA and the government labs - get rid of the rest - and give them the sole job of finding a clean, sustainable replacement for oil. This should be our focus, just like the space program was in the sixties. There must be more (OK, there is). We should stop this ridiculous War on Drugs. How is it anyone's business if the neighbor is firing up the bong in his basement. At least he won't be beating his wife and kids. And he'll be ordering a lot of pizzas. Again, good for the economy!! We should regulate drugs and, of course, tax the hell out of them (again, a consumption-based tax). This will get rid of about half of our crime and take care of the prison crowding problem. Cops can get back to their actual jobs which is putting violent offenders away forever. Of course, they won't have their fat asset forfeiture deal anymore, but then again, they won't need it since they won't have to chase dopers anymore. We should have an amnesty for prisoners convicted of non-violent drug crimes. Why should we pay to keep them in prison. Let 'em out and make them pay their own way like the rest of us. We can take all the money we save and start extensive education and treatment programs for drug rehabilitation. Worked for smoking! But blueem - you're making too much sense. I know, I know.
Blueem, excellent post, and I DO vote Libertarian! In many ways it's sickening what the U.S. has become, but it was bound to happen sooner or later...
Can you imagine how many tax dollars you could generate by legalizing dope? Not to mention the money saved from court, policing and prison costs. And medically it's less harmful to the body than alcohol or tobacco. The fact that it's still illegal is absolutely mindboggling!
Gee, I haven't even gotten wound up yet I can hardly go out in public anymore since my ideas are apparently so radical. Hell, my folks probably wouldn't let me in the door if I wasn't family. Here's a few more . . . The Democrats should convert from a political party to a charity. This way, we can cut our taxes and those folks that are just dying to give their money away can do so of their own free will. Probably feel a lot better about it, too, since it won't be at gun point like the income tax. We ought to take religion completely out of politics. Hey, believe whatever you want, but don't try to force it down MY throat. I'm talking freedom FROM religion. We ought to give politicians a single full time ad in the local paper and a single hour on TV to state their position one time only. We should prohibit them from doing anything else. Cut the heck out of corporate ownership of the political system. We ought to give Nevada to the Israelis and let them start over there. Landscapes the same. There is never gonna be peace in the Middle East. They all hate each other so much, it's genetic. I don't see where they have any more right to the holy land than, say, the Native Americans had to the land we ripped off from them. Let's just forget about race and start treating each other like human beings instead. You're either a good human being who wants to be a productive member of society or you're a lousy human being who wants to be a parasite on the good human beings. Quit whining and get busy. Were even gonna cut your taxes so when you do get busy it actually benefits you. I'm not totallly unfeeling. I have a soft spot in my heart for old folks, children, the disabled and animals. These are the ones that are unable to fend for themselves. And I will gladly and whole-heartedly take some of the tax dollars I won't be paying and send them to the new Democratic charity to help these folks out. Healthcare is totally out of control. We ought to have medical clinics where we can sign away our rights to sue for malpractice so these poor docs don't have to carry insurance and can provide great medical care at a reasonable cost. There is no coincidence in the fact that the ascendancy of lawyers has paralleled the decline of this once great nation. Back to oil, once we have an alternative energy source, the Arabs can go back to living in tents in the desert. They sure as hell won't have any money left to support terrorists with. Takes you back to that Superbowl ad accusing drug users of supporting terrorism. Fact of the matter is, you buy gasoline and you are supporting terrorism! But blueem, you have gone too far. I know. I know.
Almost forgot . . . The number one problem on this planet is too damn many people. The world's population has like doubled in the last century and is scheduled to double again by 2050. You think we got problems now? Not enough energy. Not enough water. Not enough food. Just wait. It's gonna make Soylent Green look like paradise. I say screw you and the Suburban you drove up in. If you really care about this planet your number one issue is birth control. We ought to be paying people NOT to have kids rather than giving them more deductions. And to those religious folks who quote "go forth and multiply" . . . that was a hell of an idea back when there were only a 100 million of us, but it sucks pretty bad right now.
For 1999, the most recent year for which complete Internal Revenue Service statistics were available, 6.3 million taxpayers whose incomes were in the top 5 percent paid more than 55 percent of all income taxes. They had adjusted gross incomes above $120,846 a year, meaning spouses could earn a bit over $60,000 each and be considered among the nation's richest. "It's very easy to move into the top echelon of taxpayers," Hodge said. The wealthiest 1 percent â those earning $293,415 and up â paid more than a third of the taxes, while their share of the nation's taxable income was 19 percent. They pay income taxes at the top rate, now 38.6 percent, compared with a maximum rate of 15 percent for most lower-earning taxpayers. Taxpayers in the bottom half paid only 4 percent of income taxes in 1999, according to the IRS. These 63 million taxpayers earned, on average, less than $26,415 a year. Going back to 1989, the top 5 percent income group paid about 44 percent of income taxes, the bottom almost 6 percent. Then, the top tax rate paid by high earners was 31 percent.
Who are you Paul Ehrlich reincarnated? That statement just does not carry any water at all buddy. Rather than reading down the list of your libertarian gripes, why not search for some actual evidence to support your claims. You'll probably get taken a lot more seriously. Re: Taxes Agree with just about everything that has been said. Just one more little thing though, don't forget how much the situation has IMPROVED and that US is still a lot better off than most other industrialized countries (with decent living standards). Highest US marginal rate 1980: 70% Highest Marginal Rates other nations (current): Belgium: 58% Denmark: 59% Germany: 59% France:54% Netherlands:52% Italy:51% Or compare it to Australia (i know this one, used to live there): 48.5% AND this rate kicks in after a mere $35,000US. An industrialized nation that's doing it right? New Zealand. NO capital gains tax. (long term)