All of these issues are outside of the valid ID requirement you asserted as necessary on sales of guns. You made that the stand alone issue because you made it a comparable right to voting and was using it as a validating argument for voter identification. The fact of the matter is valid id is not required for private sales in many states. Other federal laws that may get broken during the transaction are not relevant to your claim. It should also be noted that if people actually cared about voter fraud they would go after vote by mail. That is far and away the largest area of voter fraud. There is a higher rate of Americans getting struck by lightening than committing inperson voter fraud. But why do republicans make voter ID and now “exact match” such a big deal? Because they want to suppress minorities (who tend to be more poor than the general population) and women (who tend not to have exact match because of marriage).
As usual, you are being obtuse. NO state allows the sale of a firearm to a person who is prohibited by law to own one -- private sale or not. In many if not most private sales, the parties know each other. In those cases, no ID is necessary to meet this requirement. WTF should someone selling a firearm to their brother, for example, be required to see an ID? Anti-2A leftists like you only lose credibility when you misrepresent laws like these. So keep at it
Even if all of the above were accepted as being true, it is also true that if most of those who allege hardship were to receive a notice in the mail that they had just won a large screen TV and 100 gift certificate to Red Lobster- but had to present ID to claim it- there would be some hustling around and that ID would appear mighty fast or else they would go over to their local/state office and get one of the alternative forms of ID that are available for people who do not have driver's licenses.
And I'm sure if a TSA agent sees his brother trying to board a plane, he doesn't check the ID either. The entire point of this conversation is that ID should be required to vote. You tried to make the argument that you don't need an ID to buy a gun, so why should you have to have one to vote - which is absurd. While there are some very rare instances where you can get a gun while either skirting the law or skirting the intent of the law, the fact of the matter is these loopholes should be closed (as I have said before) and ID should be required in all gun purchases - period. So here I am, as an avid 2A supporter, saying that I am perfectly fine with ID being required to purchase a firearm. You agree that not having ID to purchase a firearm is ridiculous. You somehow don't think that having an ID to vote is a similar sensible requirement. If there is anyone inconsistent here, it is clearly you. I have no problem at all with that. Make "vote by mail" completely unacceptable. That's just silly. About 40 people die each year (I had to look it up to be sure it was so low). Saying that less than 40 commit voter fraud is just insanely stupid.
Oh no, my stance is that your argument is Swiss cheese and poorly based. As to incidences of voter fraud and lightening, this is proven true: https://www.politifact.com/wisconsi...happens-more-people-struck-lightning-or-peop/
Irrelevant argument. Snappy though and it has the sufficient inferences that will get the hoople heads grabbing the pitchforks.
Sorry Cowboy but you just dismissed a totally relevant argument because it is too relevant for your convenience. It is central to the issue of voter id requirement to eliminate real obstacles versus just lack of motivation- the root cause of most voter id problems. Many dem voters are allegedly "unable" to come up with voter id, but if you notified them that their free large screen TV that they just won is available to be picked up saturday morning with proper ID, THAT TV BE MOVING OUT OF THE STORE ON SATURDAY MORNING.. PERIOD!!
Funny, that was what I was thinking your argument was. Bullshit on a whole new level. It's not "proven true" because two democrats said it. I provided examples of voter fraud - not my problem if you want to ignore them and quote Booker (lol!) and some Wisconsin democrat against ID laws. Of course, it totally ignores the fraud that goes undetected because of lax voter ID laws, which is the whole point here.
As the Presidential Advisory Commission on Election Integrity convenes its first meeting on Wednesday, the issue of voter fraud in American elections has become even more contentious and hyperbolic. One of the left’s main arguments against reform is that voter fraud simply does not occur. How liberals arrive at this conclusion, we cannot say. Time and again, studies and analyses point to one incontrovertible conclusion: that voter fraud is a real and pressing issue that deserves serious solutions, and The Heritage Foundation has the evidence to prove it. On Thursday, The Heritage Foundation is releasing a new edition of its Voter Fraud Database. Featuring well over 100 new cases, the database documents 1,071 instances of voter fraud spanning 47 states, including 938 criminal convictions. This revamped edition of the database separates cases by type of disposition, allowing readers to easily distinguish not only what type of fraud occurred but the outcome of the case—criminal convictions, pre-trial diversion programs, and other types of adjudication used in various states and counties across the United States. Below are a few of the egregious examples recently added to the database. Virginia Andrew Spieles, a former James Madison University student, pleaded guilty to a charge stemming from his false submission of 18 voter registration forms during the summer of 2016. He had been working for Harrisonburg VOTES, a voter registration organization affiliated with the Democratic Party, and used false birth dates and Social Security numbers to register deceased persons to vote. Spieles was given prison time for his crime. This incident is just one of hundreds of cases in the database where individuals illegally registered dead people, names out of the phone book, or others to vote. While Spieles was caught before votes could be cast on behalf of those falsely registered individuals, there have been many other cases in which ballots were successfully cast in the name of deceased people. In fact, a 2012 Pew study concluded that 1.8 million voters remained on the rolls after their passing—a grave vulnerability to the integrity of our elections. Maryland Fredericus Hubertus Slicher, an illegal alien living in Baltimore, was convicted of numerous charges in 2014. He was residing illegally in the United States, collecting Medicare and Social Security benefits, and voting in U.S. elections. Slicher had been present in the United States illegally since his temporary work visa expired in 1969. He was convicted of child abuse in 2004, was a registered sex offender, and yet he continued to vote numerous times despite being ineligible. His case was referred to Immigration and Customs Enforcement, and he was sentenced to three months’ imprisonment, one year’s supervised release, and was ordered to pay $48,928 in restitution. The newest additions to the database included a dozen cases of illegal voting by noncitizens. This is a particularly important issue to address, as each ballot cast by a noncitizen effectively nullifies the ballot of an eligible voter, effectively disenfranchising American citizens. Ohio Debbie Tingler of Reynoldsburg, Ohio, pleaded guilty (Case No. 12 CR 005249) to illegal voting in 2013. She had registered to vote, requested absentee ballots, and submitted those ballots under two names—Debbie Tingler and Deborah Tingler. She was given a suspended sentence of 120 days’ imprisonment, and she was ordered to pay a $200 fine and court costs. Tingler’s experience is not uncommon. There are dozens of cases in the database where individuals voted multiple times in the same election. Given the fact that few states have adequate policies and procedures in place to detect and deter fraud—and prosecutors seldom prioritize these cases—it is likely that far more double voters, absentee-ballot fraudsters, and ineligible voters get away scot-free than are ever brought to justice. The Heritage Foundation’s Voter Fraud Database is by no means comprehensive, but its 1,071 proven instances of fraud, which took place across all manner of elections and in nearly every state, highlight the importance—and the urgency—of the work of the Election Integrity Commission. What is needed now is more data to permit analysis aimed at determining, among other things, whether the nation’s voter registration records are accurate or riddled with errors. In the coming months, the Commission—which includes Heritage’s own Hans von Spakovsky, senior legal fellow and one of the nation’s foremost election law experts—will seek to gather this information. Unfortunately, so far, even innocuous requests for public voter records have been met with hyperbolic rhetoric and stonewalling in some states. This begs the question, why? If fraud is as rare as liberals say, and if state protections against it are as robust as we are told, why withhold data that would prove these claims? Perhaps liberals are afraid that the data might, in fact, say the opposite. One can deny facts for only so long, and with this newest release of The Heritage Foundation’s Voter Fraud Database, the evidence is clear and incontrovertible: Voter fraud is real, and we ignore it at our own peril. This piece originally appeared in The Daily Signal
Of course you do because you want to believe what the right wing media tells you. I have cited the state of Virginia, the Houston chronicle, a law website you have given nothing besides a presidential advisory committee that was suspiciously terminated and conjecture. Do you still want to stand behind your statement that a valid ID is needed for every gun purchase? Additionally, democrats do make true statements on occasion as cited by PolitiFact. So don’t dispute the statement because a democrat said it, that’s playing to the mob. You have to dispute PolitiFact’s findings.