I bet he made much more than you trading. "I had a friend some years ago who is far more intelligent than I am. His IQ (for those who care about such things) is in the 140s, and he is a professor of electrical engineering at a prestigious university. He has won numerous teaching awards and is known throughout the world for his expertise in the field of electromagnetics. Further, he is one of the most emotionally stable people I ever knew. At around the same time that I began taking an interest in trading and the markets, he became somewhat interested as well. He studied the markets for a while (over the course of a few months in his spare time) and tried his hand at it. He lost money. Then he lost some more. Not long after, he became discouraged. I have no doubt whatsoever that if he had continued in his efforts and not started trading prematurely, that he would have succeeded eventually. But he did not apply the dedication to trading that he applied to his occupation. He was looking for something relatively quick, in his spare time. Trading is a skill that can be learned, but it is not an easy skill to learn. Some learn better than others and some learn faster than others, just as in any field. Those who underestimate the challenge of their chosen field seldom do well."
But that part (the emotional and cognitive difficulties) is such a big part of trading, that my answer is no. So you are saying, that most randomly choosen people (not preselected) can learn pretty much any system? Again, famous traders disagree with you, 3 out of 4 said (see again Market Wizzards books) they couldn't teach their systems for one reason or other. One of them even said, that he could publish his trading rules in the WSJ, and he is sure that most people wouldn't be able to follow them. Here is another evidence: Years ago I was on a list where the guru was teaching most of his system for free. He had a paying version too, but he gave away most of the info for free. I tested his system and used it too, it was profitable. Nevertheless people kept signing up for his paid service and even after 3-4 months when the system should have been learnt, kept asking basic questions and didn't dare to make the trades and so on. It was perfect for the guru, because they stayed on the paying service indefiniatelly.... But of course gurus are not going to tell people that MOST people can not learn trading, because then where would they get the income?? If anyone has evidence or statistics to the contrary, I am interested in it. Steve's one personal example (hey, I was able to learn trading) is not statistics. By the way Steve. Hate to say goodbye to you, but you have to hit my garbage can. Bitching about grammar is one thing, not providing an argument is another. You are on ignore from now on...
Not a very strong case, IMO. By your own admission, the guru taught a strategy that made money. Just because a few don't learn it does not support your case that trading can't be taught. To trade successfully, you need to have some capital, a plan, a few strategies, be willing to work hard, strive to constantly improve, and the ability to take action. Seriously, ANYONE can learn to do it successfully. How does one go about it, well that's a different argument. Some say learn yourself, others say find a mentor. I say a good coach can provide valuable insight into what works, significantly shorten the learning curve, teach some of the necessary skill sets in terms of trade execution, research, and evalutaion.
A good mentor is invaluable. Mine will most likely end up running a huge hedge fund down the road, he's that good. Not bad to have a guy like that to help you through tough times.
Cognitive ability and modicum of emotional stability is a requisite to performing most tasks of any significance. It is not limited to trading. Therefore, successful trading is not necessarily limited to just a few people. In my opinion, more such people don't do well at it for the reasons I mentioned in my earlier post. Also, I don't really believe that professional trading means learning or using someone else's system. At best, that is a starting point rather than an end point. You get out what you put in. True professionals seldom pay others to do their own work for them. And by that, I don't mean tangential support services in connection with your craft, but the integral element of it. If you are paying someone else to provide you with a system that is the basis for your trading, then all you are is a customer. Just my opinion, of course.
I heard some people saying that now it's harder to make money in this business compare to 10 years ago. And some people that succeeded to make money before can't make anymore. It seems that it has nothing to do with the number of participants increased in the last decade, neither with the number of participants having innate talents increased, how can we be sure that we have more those talented in Wall Street? Perhaps it's related to the Internet that allow people to access more trading materials, get educated and as well they are indirectly trained by the available online information. Then they became more sophisticated?
agreed. Although I believe there are ways to enchance the attributes you are born with such as intuition.
It depends where in the process the person starts. I think people with zero trading experience and no market knowledge and taught only one or two set ups have the most potential to be successful. John
Hi Steve, Can you expand on the "build-up" process? What is being built? Are you talking about confidence, position size, etc? I mean what are the goals, direction and destination? And how do you know if you are off the course besides the P/L? Thank you for your help. Regards, William
i think you misunderstood me. i was hoping someone would give an example of the "born talent" that's required for trading that's comparable to the examples i gave.