Strategy: Selling Put Options: The Best Income Method?

Discussion in 'Options' started by botpro, Feb 28, 2016.

  1. botpro

    botpro

    Help in understanting the concepts is welcome, but I haven't asked anybody for advice, nor do I need any advice.

    Be suspicious of people trying to give you an unwanted advice.

    Be suspicious of "experts" ;-)

    This is a journey everybody should do himself only, without letting other types bring you from your road that you need to go first.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2016
    #131     Mar 2, 2016
  2. destriero

    destriero

    Twit, a short put is a synthetic covered call. Yeah, you've just invented the wheel.
     
    #132     Mar 2, 2016
    i960 likes this.
  3. botpro

    botpro

    I know that it is a synthetic call. But it is irrelevant for the topic of this discussion, cf. the title...

    I would suggest to open a new thread if you need to discuss synthetics...
     
    #133     Mar 2, 2016
  4. botpro

    botpro

    Someone here said that if one likes the stock, but follows this strategy of selling puts (as opposed to straight buying the stock),
    then one would not participate in possible tanking of the stock upwards.
    Hmm... I'm not sure if that is correct. I think it is very well possible as the following article indicates:
    http://www.great-option-trading-strategies.com/closing-options-early.html
    "Closing Options Early
    Question - Closing Options Early
    When writing puts (naked puts), do you ever close a profitable trade early? Or is it better to allow the options to expire worthless?
    If you do buy back a naked put early, what criteria do you use?
    [...]"

    In that scenario one closes the position before the expiration date,
    and by this action increases the yield by shorting the timeframe of the investment...
     
    #134     Mar 2, 2016
  5. destriero

    destriero


    No, it is a synthetic covered call.
     
    #135     Mar 2, 2016
  6. botpro

    botpro

    As already said: irrelevant for this discussion.

    Sorry, but you are just risking to land in my IL... ;-)
     
    #136     Mar 2, 2016
  7. destriero

    destriero

    I don't know if you're joking or microcephalic. You won't have a loss in a month with the shares at $90? The July 97.5P is 3.60 here. So where do you think the July 90P will be trading if ATM? No loss because you state it is so?

    This thread is a cautionary tale. I truly hope that you borrow money and trade vol.
     
    #137     Mar 2, 2016
    i960 likes this.
  8. botpro

    botpro

    As said:
    Be suspicious of people trying to give you an unwanted advice.
    Be suspicious of "experts" ;-)

    The example just shows that there is some more work to do to add into the trading system before one can go live.
    I'll develop a trading system around put selling. It is the most complicated system I had to do with yet.
    Yes, I have already one good long-only options system, but it is a "brute force" system that needs trading a basket of at least 10 uncorrelated instruments
    and doing many trades per day, and requiring a relatively big acct.
    This new system will be an "intelligent" system doing as few trades as necessary and with much less capital requirement.
    Oh, btw, I'm a programmer, I just need to code everything, need to automate it... ;-)
    I don't like monotone/discrete/manual/emotional trading... AutoTrading with intelligent bots is the way to go...
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2016
    #138     Mar 3, 2016
  9. botpro

    botpro

    Todo:
    The main problem that remains to be solved is when the stock falls towards close the strike,
    or goes even lower, while there is still much time till expiration of the option...
    Hmm. what possibilities do I have in such a scenario?...
    Ok, selling even more puts would reduce my average...
    Or selling a call as a protective measure to lock-in the status-quo (ie. hedging) and wait till the stock rebounds, and then close the short call... or whichever of the two is more promising...
    Any other alternative?...

    (just thinking aloud... ;-)
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2016
    #139     Mar 3, 2016
  10. i960

    i960

    Do you even know what vega and gamma are? Let me tell you what they are: they're the things that are going to tear you a new one because you refuse to listen to those who've been there before you.

    I can't tell if we're being trolled here or you're really that hard headed/unwilling to listen - critical SINS of any trader. No you actually shouldn't be suspicious of people who know this shit in and out and have seen every Joe Blow come along and proclaim how much "income" they're going to make selling covered calls or naked puts. It's not a grail and it's not new.
     
    #140     Mar 3, 2016
    OddTrader likes this.