Spotting market short orders on NYSE

Discussion in 'Trading' started by cornholetrading, Oct 25, 2002.

  1. I have been trading NYSE stocks now for 2-3 months after trading nasdaq stocks for awhile. Today I just realized something new which probably seems rather obvious to the more experienced NYSE traders out there but a simple of explanation would help me a lot. I am surprised I have done as well as I have and not known this. Anyway my question is on spotting market orders, especially short orders, on NYSE stocks. I guess I always assumed it was the same as for nasdaq stocks but then remembered the short rules are completely different (kind of forget when you use bullets). I know for nasdaq it would be easy to spot say a market INCA order because he would follow the price down always a penny above the inside bid and same thing for buy market orders on the way up. However NYSE market orders trade completely different and partly I am assuming is because of the differences in the short rule. So some of my questions are:

    How do you spot a short market order on NYSE? What are you looking for in the prints and with the spread/NYSE quote to confirm this is a market order and not just a size limit offer? What about how buy market orders look like with the way the size is moved up and how the spread/quotes are reflected for the move up? Can these types of orders be seen in large cap higher volume or high volume news stocks or do they mostly apply to lower volume NYSE stocks? Let say by high volume I mean 4 million shares a day or more. If they can't be applied to higher volume stocks then what are some of the things you look for to spot short sellers/sellers in the stock?
  2. catman


    There's no way of telling whether what you are seeing is short or long, whether NAS or can only speculate on what you are seeing, therefore there is no way of knowing for sure.
  3. yes there is.
    Cornhole....I PM'd you
  4. TG


    Would appreciate any insights on distinguishing short orders, NYSE or NAZ.
  5. catman


    why don't you post your response here? I would like to see how you can be sure whether an order is short or long...

    I stand by my statement that you can only speculate unless shown otherwise.
  6. nusrat


    Maybe he meant "9x.x% confidence". Anyhow, maybe sdtrader will share it with the rest of us if you promise not to flame him.
    I'm very interested in hearing his ideas.
  7. Christopher Farrell had an article on it in the last 6 months in Active Trader or TASC.

    Help me out here because I do not do a lot of listed. I'll desribe what I recall.

    It has to do with the uptick rule. There is a sudden reduction in the spread to say a penny accompanied by a huge increase in the ask shown representing short orders being improved by the specialist in the cheapest possible way to get a tick and allow the short.

    Farrell said this was an imminent sign of a tank.

    That's what I recall. He might be or something like that.

  8. catman


    The question was "how can you spot a short"......

    you can't, plain and simple...

    you can only speculate about what you are seeing and how you want to interpret it is subjective...... :cool:
  9. Catman------Im sure he will be happy to if you provide him with better commissions and software........:cool: sugarhilgang.....
  10. nusrat


    OK, let's rephrase the issue more painstakingly:

    Among those people who have been and remain willing to potentially delude themselves in thinking that it's possible, what techniques do they use to identify [apocryphal] short-sales?
    #10     Oct 25, 2002