https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/somethi...y-s-stormy-relationship-with-europe-1.1424390 Something Has Snapped in Italy’s Stormy Relationship With Europe John Follain and Alessandra Migliaccio, Bloomberg News Angela Merkel and Matteo Renzi hold a press conference in Florence in 2015. Photographer: Guido Bergmann/Bundesregierung via Getty Images , Photographer: Guido Bergmann/Bundesregierung via Getty Images (Bloomberg) -- The foundations for the European Union were laid six decades ago in Rome and some officials in the Eternal City are starting to think they might just be seeing the beginning of its breakup. After Boris Johnson and the Brexiteers laid to rest the carefully cultivated myth of the EU’s irreversibility, europhiles argued that Britain was a special case, an island nation that could never fully commit to the continent. It’s different when Italy turns against you. The bloc’s third-largest economy has flirted with euroskepticsm before as it railed against budget rules or struggled to cope with successive waves of refugees heading north from Africa. But when Covid-19 struck Lombardy, Italians still expected Europe would come to their aid with no questions asked. Instead, what they think they got was small print and a cold shoulder. Germany and France hoarded protective gear for themselves and Christine Lagarde at the European Central Bank brushed off their financial distress. Since then money has been promised and apologies were made, but that initial hesitation left a wound. “Italy was in love with the European project and it has fallen out of love,” said Marc Lazar, a history professor at Sciences Po University in Paris. “I don’t know if Europe will be able to regain that trust.” Senior figures from across government, from the central bank and even in Prime Minister Giuseppe Conte’s office talk of an unprecedented wave of anger toward the EU that is surging through a country watching thousands die each week and their economy implode. Several even confessed to sharing that feeling themselves. In one survey this month, 59% of respondents said the EU as it is now makes no sense any more. In another, most Italians described China as a friend and almost half said Germany was the enemy. Even an arch pro-European like Matteo Renzi is disillusioned. Five years ago the former prime minister courted Germany’s Angela Merkel in front of Michelangelo’s David in his native Florence. Now a junior — yet crucial — partner in Conte’s coalition, he expresses his dismay. Renzi said the problem in Italy is that both part of the right and part of the ruling coalition “says everything is Europe’s fault.” Conte will join his fellow leaders for another summit-by-video conference on Thursday and repeat his appeal for the joint bond issuance that has come to symbolize for Italians the solidarity that northern Europe has denied them. “If Italians don’t see a positive outcome, euroskepticism will grow, or also an anti-Germany policy which could be rooted in our country’s deep psychological past,” Pier Paolo Baretta, undersecretary at the finance ministry, said. “In our historic memory, Germany has always been an adversary in times of difficulty.” Conte almost certainly won’t get what he wants — the political costs for Merkel and Mark Rutte of the Netherlands would just be too great at this point — and that leaves Italy heading down a dangerous path. French President Emmanuel Macron says the EU could collapse as a result. There’s an element of brinkmanship in that rhetoric, of course. The last time the EU threatened to split, the Greeks capitulated in the end. And officials in Rome will recognize that the package that the Germans and the Dutch are offering is a good one in financial terms. But they hate the way it’s been done. They remember that moment in February when the Carnival of Venice was canceled, the virus was spreading through Italy’s prosperous heartland and the rest of Europe turned its back. Germany and France banned the export of face masks and gloves. Other partners imposed border controls. Lagarde at the ECB triggered a historic selloff in Italian (and European) markets and the Dutch Finance Minister Wopke Hoekstra revived the arguments of the debt crisis, managing to imply that Italy was to blame for its plight. Those policy settings have all been adjusted since then as it became apparent that Italy had been the victim of a global pandemic. European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen even offered an apology for not “being there.” But the damage was done. And it’s not hard to imagine how things unravel further from here. Conte governs at the head of an unstable coalition led by the anti-establishment Five Star Movement and the establishment Democratic Party that only came together last year to keep out their mutual foe, Matteo Salvini of the right-wing populist League. The League is the most popular party in Italy, now leading the Democrats by about eight percentage points and Salvini is waiting for another chance to seize power. In the past, he has toyed with the idea of ditching the euro. But as he rose to national prominence he read the mood of the country and went out of his way to play that down. Not any more. “This isn’t a ‘union,’” Salvini said on March 27. “This is a nest of snakes and jackals.” Then he set out his pitch to Italians. “First we defeat the virus, then we have a rethink about Europe,” he said. “If it helps, we say goodbye. Without even a thank you.” ©2020 Bloomberg L.P.
A good old story of one survey that was done in half dead elders cottage, where an average person has about 30% of grey brain cell left. All it takes to form public opinion. Send in - some face masks. (damn, in the past it used to be weapons...) From a country, where at the same time, in one side of it, kidneys are being sold, to buy iPhones, while in another, people are being taken away, for buying iPhones. Then they quote some radical nationalist/populist : Reminds those hamaz omans, who shares prophecies about Israel burning in hell & eternal flames. And good luck with that :
Many Italians now thinking that the E.U. abandoned them. All of this is because of Covid-19 pandemic.
For Italians, those who help them are friends, those who do not help them are the enemy. That's the logic of simplicity that is used by egoists, in this case the Italians. Italy had big fights about the budget rules that had to be followed according to the EU. Italy said: f*ck EU. The Italians will create a much bigger deficit. And now they get in trouble and start to wine for money from the EU. EU should now also say:f*ck Italy. They want Eurobonds to let pay others a part of the Italian bill and to profit from a better credit rating than the Italian one. As long as EU countries will always try to take advantage of the EU for their own benefit instead of thinking European, the EU will never be a success. I only agree that Italy did not receive enough support from the EU to stop the illegal immigration. But the way the EU is managing that problem is a disaster allover the EU. Not only in Italy. The south of Europe is a "failed states area" that should not have been part of the EU before they had everything in order.
And some countries have sent face masks and other equipment as aid. I guess they don't matter as they're not Germany and France. Each country has it's own problems dealing with this, if Germany and France send their supply to Italy, the voters wouldn't like it.
Great points, yet something worth arguing tho : It's sorta right, but reminds of those regions in specific countries, that wants their own independence at the cost of the rest (little regions/cities with ports, that generates majority of countries GDP ,,- Oh, if we would separate , we would be living like kings !'' Yes, sure, isolated and with no army...Swits / Lichtenstein, that's another story) Also, e.g my country, recently rejected big investment offer from China, which was directed into our port, due the obvious fact related to national security.(CCP looking for other routes than Russia in Baltic Region) Leave little countries like that ,,alone/aside'' - and the question of how long those offers would be rejected, would get answered pretty fast. Simply does not work that way. If those southern regions ain't gonna find support in the north, they will find it - abroad. Damn, shame. Old continent and still can't figure it out. But, i think , that the situation is getting better. With the tech kicking in and people traveling freely, just my guess, mostly, the levels of nationalism in Europe, are going lower- if looking through historical charts. (with >exceptions< tho and that is only a guess) Those political games that used to work out 80 years ago, are being brought to daylight, much faster these days. Much harder for some, absolute idiot to climb up to the top of ladders. (the irony, again, with few minor exceptions...)
and we, Switzerland, a prospering country are doomed, as doom is in every country around us. F*** this.
Well they can sell strategic companies to China like Greece did with their port of Piraeus. That will lead to colonization by China. China wants to control as much countries as possible by buying only strategic economical organizations. And as China is not a democracy, these countries risk to have cameras installed allover the place like in China so that the dictators in China can control them. Corona and Hong Kong are good examples. Putin does the same in Russia. Controlling media, close down internet connections that go outside of Russia, forbid the use of VPN, manipulate elections, killing opponents...
Took me two years, to learn not to curse in real life ; il make an exception this time - and when first stuff like that, would start to happen in their countries, then they would be like : ,,F this S ; Europe please accept us back''
%% Maybe; maybe not. Swiss chocolate has amazing flavor. And the ''Red Bull/Green Bull/Yellow Bull drink'' seems to be doing fine=amazing they ship that all the waY TO us/usa + STILL MAKE A PROFIT. Don't know is swiss miss drink is swiss made or not???????????????????????????????