stock777, Quite true. With MB Trading we've had a couple of unlucky executions when things started tumbling right at the mouse click. One was even unlucky to the tune of 3/4 of a percent. The problem is when you get a price which is a full percent below the current bid/ask, and the bid/ask are neither fluctuating or moving down. Granted, I've only made about 150 trades with MB so far, but this nonsense would happen about every 5th trade with Scottrade, so I think my sample size is large enough to say that I'm not the problem. I am also a scientist, so I freely admit that my results might be unique and coincidental, not having a large enough sample size from either company. The execution times I have shown, on the other hand, are fairly conclusive. Once is too much, twice is unforgivable, and five or six times in three months is enough that anyone who reads this should be scared of Scottrade. Their fees are fairly small (although MB's are smaller), but what good is saving a buck when you lose $200 on every 5th trade?
did not know that. They don't advertise it, which tells you who they're after. Bright will tell you he thinks they don't need commissions. They trade against you enough to benefit just from order flow.
Sullux, with MB trading what kind of fills do you get on their TTO orders (the threshold triggered orders which use market orders)?
I haven't used a TTO yet, but I can comment on their stops and trailing stops. While their executions are instantaneous, we haven't quite figured out what triggers the stop. It seems that the triggers are a little slow sometimes (while other times, they are spot-on). This means that we have seen our stop get blown past before kicking us out, but I think the worst was about 7 cents between our stop price and our executed price. My general impression of MBT is that they cater to day-traders like me. Their running PL shows the profit you would get if you closed the position with a market order, so that if the bid/ask are .03/.05, it will show what your profit would be at .03, even if the current tick is .04 (unlike Scottrade, which would show your profit at .04). On the other hand, I get the feeling that stops are geared towards the tick, although I haven't been able to ascertain that with a great deal of certainty. It would be nice to be able to use a stop which would kick you out if the bid alone were to hit, but I don't think that's how they do it.
I use Scottrade Elite to daytrade and never use market order. The reason I stick with Scottrade (although I also trade with InteractiveBrokers) is that their strengths align with my trading strategies. You have to evaluate different brokers and see how your trading style is best met by all of them before deciding. For me, direct access broker is NOT a crucial thing. I never had any problem with the customer service at Scottrade. In fact, they have been very good.
let's say you were trading SPY and it made a large move fast and hit your stop really quickly....how bad would the slippage be using a stop market order via MBTX routing?
Honesty requires that I say some good things about Scottrade. You have seen fairly convincing evidence that their market executions lack in many ways. That is the most important point for many traders. On the pro side, however, their customer service is good (besides not refunding any of my money), their quotes are extremely fast and reliable (more so than my current broker), and their software is somewhat easy to use (when it works). If I could, I would keep my Scottrade account solely for the quotes and keep trading with MBT for the executions. I hope I've been fair. For many of us, executions are the single most important factor of any brokerage, so I hope I've warned away any traders who use market orders. Others who aren't hindered by these problems will not be criticized by me for choosing to stay with Scottrade.
Elite platform, although Java-based, is pretty fast, reliable, and customizable. It offers all the features I need although I really don't need a lot for my system. (IB TWS sucks big time compared to Elite, but that's just my opinion.) Execution speed is almost instant in almost all cases. When the market is going crazy, it's slow, but I think that's true for most brokers. I don't normally trade when the market is going berzerk. Customer service is great. Real person always answers my call and address the issue promptly. I can be a real jackass when the problems occur, but they are always courteous and help me out.
DataCruncher, You may very well have some slippage with your stop-markets. I usually get a price which is at or within about .1% of my stop price (so basically a penny or two). The worst I have had is .25% past my stop price, and that was when AKAM suddenly dropped like a rock (which it is want to do). That would mean about 30 cents slippage in a $120 issue, although a more expensive stock like that would probably not slip as much as a $28 stock like AKAM because a stop can be inherently more accurate in a more expensive stock. I can tell you want some hard numbers, but with only two month's trading with MB, that's the best I can do. Now ask me about slippage with Scottrade .