Sacandals, markets and a global view

Discussion in 'Trading' started by andrasnm, Jul 10, 2002.

  1. The really damaging aspect of this is the U.S. and corporate America tries to sell itself as the 'shining city on the hill' of ethical business practices. to some extent it worked, foreign firms that were caught bribing or cheating were ostracized.

    Unfortunately now all the Chinese, Japanese, Russians, Saudis and other vermin of the business world will sit back and gloat how we're no better than they are, perpetuating the cycle of greed, corruption, cheating. in other words, God help the few honest business people out there because while ethical business practices are good for your soul they'll likely put you out of business.

    You can not divorce fundamentals from your charts! This is the real thing IMHO and the markets will get a lot worst before they get any better.
  2. I agree. It seems that whenever I deal with a business, especially on the internet, they're constantly trying to rip me off. You have to battle with them just to get them to give you what they promised.
  3. In the securities markets, trillions of dollars change hands daily on a simple verbal agreement. That's not too bad.

    America used to be a great place to do business. You have to ask yourself, who makes up this new economy? What were they taught? What are their values? Because that's what dictates the way they do business -- whether they listen to their consciences or not, whether they have consciences or not, whether they will do anything for a buck or not, whether telling the truth matters to anyone anymore and, if it doesn't, why not?

    What's different about the US today than, say, 40 years ago?

    I have some theories...

    <font size=1>-- <i>Sergey Brin, Cofounder of Google and former citizen of USSR. From Red Herring, July, 2002, p 28</i>

    "Don't blame the truth if you've loved a lie."
    -- <i>The Waiting</i></font>
  4. I think that what we are seeing is a true minority within the US markets. In this viscious bear market people are looking for scapegoats. These people (Enron, WCOM etc) are truly bad people and guilty of fraud, manipulation and moral bankrupcy. These types of scandals were happening in 1997-1999, just that the "piblic" was making so much money, the press and the politicians had no motive to kill the goose that was lying IPO eggs. Now, with the public losing money everyone is jumping on the scapegoat bandwagon. I contend that the percentages of wrong doers is not any different today than it has been historically. There have always been scandals from business, religious (Jim Baker) and political (too many to name) arenas.
  5. The thing about 'scandals' is that they're never quite what the media implies. In fact, in most matters, the media is probably the last place one would look for a truthful account.

    Incidentally, it's "Bakker," and, though I'm no fan, I recommend (for anyone who cares) his book "I Was Wrong," which tells his story without making himself out as an innocent victim.

    They way you say "piblic" makes me think you're Irish.:D
  6. not so much of a "morality" and fact finding mission. There are several facts IMHO.
    a) the public has lost billions already
    b) no one is staying in the markets (they all are buying real estate, cash, etc)
    c) there is a brewing public anger toward corporate america mainly due to the lay-offs and shenanigans going on.

    There is no public 'good will' and in the view of all the Gov. hypocrisy the consumer confidence is all time low.

    My view; Dow 6000 and nas 1200 before the year end or when-ever. I am in all the bear funds since June.
  7. Piblic is just poor typing and not proofing. Sorry about Baker not Bakker. I appreciate him or anyone taking responsibility for their own actions. Unlike William Jefferson Clinton.
  8. tom_p


    Which June - 2002, 2001 or 2000? If 2002, what took you so long?
  9. Mike777


    I'm not any of those nationalities but I find that comment real offense. My friend, business is done exactly the same everywhere it is just that some nations are more adept at concealing their deceit and wrongdoing and tagging it with some new MBA type paradigm. If you are just starting to notice the depth of corruption, lies and manipulation in the US economy then you have been blindly following the self deluding religion of free enterprise that most post war children believe in. I'm a capitalist but I also recognise the flaws in the system and they are deep and destructive. If you fall into the trap of thinking that 'others' are vermin then you have the same mentality that you see and dislike from certain extreme factors in the world. You are them.

    Careful with the racist comments.:mad:

    I mean careful with what could be perceived as racist comments...not implying that you are racist.
  10. Mike, business is <i>not</i> done exactly the same everywhere. Nooooooo-waaaaaaaaay.

    Though, unfortunately, it is becoming more so everyday as people buy into the globalization dream, and happily pitch their standards out the window for a buck or two.

    And can't a guy call a spade a spade without getting slapped with the unforgiveable sin label? Hey, dude, the 90's are <i>over!!!</i>
    #10     Jul 10, 2002