Rickards: ‘Bitcoin is a Ponzi Scheme’

Discussion in 'Crypto Assets' started by dealmaker, Oct 19, 2017.

  1. Pekelo

    Pekelo

    So your argument is: It is OK bitcoin being a Ponzi, because there are other overvalued assets out there.

    Splendid!!!

    Hey, at least you aren't debating the obvious...
     
    #11     Oct 21, 2017
    JackRab likes this.
  2. My Argument is, I do not understand the need to either own bitcoin or hate it. I just don't get the angry animosity. I don't see people going crazy about the $100M paintings. High end wine is another asset that has been going up in price, but I do not see people mortgaging their houses to invest into wine or scream about crazy people paying 10K per bottle, somehow everybody is OK with it. I argue that the idea behind bitcoin is remarkable and is worth understanding if nothing else.

    Another point is this. Whatever you want to call the bitcoin an overvalued asset or if you think it should not be worth anything in USD it might be a very valid point and I won't argue against it. But do not call it a ponzi scheme. You can't call everything you do not like, or do not understand or you think is overvalued a ponzi scheme. No one is suggesting there is any kind of return on your investment, you are not investing into a fund or a business.

    You think its overvalued, sure you make a good point. You think its worth 0, very well possible. But it is not a ponzi scheme. If you do not want to buy it you do not have to, just like $100M painting or $10K bottle of wine.
     
    #12     Oct 21, 2017
    johnarb and Hoi like this.
  3. carrer

    carrer

    I don't own much. I trade them on a regular basis like how I trade the stocks and futures. So, I don't really care if it is appreciating or depreciating in value, I will just go long or short.
     
    #13     Oct 22, 2017
  4. Pekelo

    Pekelo

    Except when the discussed thing has very ponzi-esque features:

    1. It needs a constant inflow of new capital to keep the price growing.
    2. Old timers are paid with the new comers' money.
    3. Holders have an us vs. them cult attitude.
    4. It might not have any other kind of value or usage. (this is mostly for alt-coins)
    5. High returns promised (with little risk).
    6. Exponential growth is needed for the promised returns.
    etc.etc.

    Now you might say, hey, that isn't much different from certain stocks, and you would be right! The stock of an unprofitable company based on a faulty business model is nothing but a ponzi, see pets.com, webvan, etc. We can throw in Twitter and Snapchat too from current stocks.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2017
    #14     Oct 22, 2017
  5. carrer

    carrer

    Everything is about sentiment/perception.
    If a company is going bankrupt but the market has a good sentiment about it, the price will still appreciate as people keep buying it.

    Same goes to BTC, even if there's no value in it but the people perceive it to be as valuable as gold, then the price will appreciate as people will bid higher.

    It boils down to the sentiment of the herd/traders, and not the actually value that is/could be calculated.
     
    #15     Oct 22, 2017
  6. 5. High returns promised (with little risk).
    6. Exponential growth is needed for the promised returns.
    etc.etc.

    Lets clarify something, who is promising you anything and with little risk lol ? The only promise you get is that this thing can go to 0 or 10K right now. Complete gamble, no one has a clue where it will go. There are no promises, there are no returns. You are buying something, its not a business, there are no ways it can generate profit.
     
    #16     Oct 22, 2017
    Hoi and johnarb like this.
  7. Pekelo

    Pekelo

    Sure. Hodlers are holding it because they believe in its usability. :)

    Just ask any bitcoin fan they promise you 10K as a minimum. Why, do you think they would hold it if they thought it goes to 1K???
     
    #17     Oct 22, 2017
  8. Holder can believe anything they want. No one is promising anything to them.
     
    #18     Oct 22, 2017
    Hoi and johnarb like this.
  9. Hoi

    Hoi

    That's BS. I do not get paid anything if you buy 1 Bitcoin. Just the same as I do not get paid by you if you buy an IBM share.

    By the way: the IMF has research that fraudulent-Ponzi idea already, and concluded that Bitcoin doesn't fall in that category (otherwise it would have been brought to Justice already, like the Onecoin case):
    https://www.coindesk.com/world-bank-report-bitcoin-naturally-occurring-ponzi/
     
    #19     Oct 23, 2017
  10. maxinger

    maxinger

    Someone should write an article :


    Bitcoin is a Ponzi Scheme.
    This is how to profit massively from it.

    Complaining doesn't help you to earn money.
    In fact, it shortens your life.
    Always look at things from opportunistic viewpoint.
     
    #20     Oct 23, 2017