Real Time Power Trading

Discussion in 'Commodity Futures' started by cc1988, Jul 27, 2011.

  1. cc1988


    Hi All,

    I have been a consultant at an energy consulting firm, mainly in the electricity section, and want to break into trading power. My only issue is that most of the jr. trader opportunities I see, still require a bit of trading knowledge. I have done work in almost ISO and have a good background in power including energy and capacity markets, system dispatch, LMPs, virtual bids, FTRs, shadow prices, etc. I have experience running and doing analysis on several of the tools traders use including Dayzer and PROMOD as well.

    Does anyone have any suggestions for getting my foot in the door?

    Thanks in advance.
  2. octsa


    I have the exactly same question a couple of month ago.

    The only way to learn it is to get there.
  3. bone

    bone ET Sponsor

    Go to the PJM website and look at the member firm listing. Send them resumes asking to interview for a quantitative analyst position - sounds like you have the background chops for that currently in place. Once you prove your worth to the firm in that regard, promotion to trader should be a given or at least you will have earned the right to interview elsewhere.

    I traded physical power in the 90's and financial power in 2006-2008; I have two clients who currently trade physical power.

    BTW, most HFs use head hunters to pursue traders.
  4. octsa


    cc1988, try to apply as a back-office officer and then you will have you will have a foot in the door. :) If you are in the U.S there are dozen if not hundred of firms list on ISOs websites.

    Question for Bone

    Good to know that you have experience in real-time power trade.

    It seems they deal electricity only on the physical side ? (Spot market 5mins and day-ahead market.) They have all the licences for the ISOS, FERC import/export authorizations, RTO...

    (What I understand is that they are selling and buying real power to real on the market but I don't know where is the line between physical and paper power trading strategies.

    Do your clients are playing on the paper-side ?
    Is it possible to trade this market interdependently and get the same edge other firms have. Clearly what is the advantage to get registered as a trading company on MISO, ERCOT.

    Are they registered with market regulators and organisms or they are doing another kind of trade like using buy/sell PJM on CBOE combined with buy/sell NG,COAL etc...

    I'M not sure I understand what is the PJM on CBOE, a derivative of the physical market but do you have access to a kind of T&S like registered firm have ?

    Not a long time ago, I had an interview with a power trading team which is (I think) very successful since their base package is good ,which is really rare or even absent in most trading firm. Maybe I could finally afford technical education from a pro to succeed and evolve faster within the firm or even independently.

    Best Regards
  5. rosy2


    do not apply for back-office!!! apply for what you want. the chances of moving are slim to none (at least at a bank/trading firm). Houston and the great plains region are filled with power and gas firms. I have seen a few desks popping up in chicago to do financial power (not including bp and citadel).
  6. cc1988


    Bone's suggestion is really good, thanks!
  7. bone

    bone ET Sponsor

    My clients love me, and the retail punters over in the educational section think I'm a scam. This site needs minimal capital and experience requirements.
  8. octsa


    (at least at a bank/trading firm)....

    - More often We are not talking big trading floors.
    - What's wrong with back-office ? that a good spot to start assisting your team, watching trades, doing data, spreadsheet modelling analysis, catch the beat with a base salary.

    I think that you must have a 500k P&L to get hired in the way you want. The traders are working 12h/day * 4-5 days a weeks to achieved that.

    12h in the front of a computer is very long, real time traders don't have a great social life so the turnover is high.

    There are many people who want this job but don't have the qualifications, skills, and at the same time many positions are left empty each 6-12 months So don't rush, once you get there they will pick you up.
  9. rosy2


    realtime power desk IS the entry level for power trading. maybe starting as a scheduler is OK, but backoffice is crap in any industry. And from what you describe " doing data, spreadsheet modelling analysis" that's not backoffice; that's an analyst who probably needs more skills than the realtime guy
    #10     Aug 25, 2011