range vs trend and how to predict it

Discussion in 'Automated Trading' started by travis, Sep 29, 2006.

  1. travis

    travis

    Yes, exactly, I used an array formula in excel, and I calculated the range between midnight and 9.30 am. Same for volume. It can all be done at the functions level. No need for vba.
     
    #21     Oct 1, 2006
  2. fader

    fader

    travis, i missed what sample period you are using - i saw you posted something for 2005-2006 - are you just using these 300-400 daily observations? have you computed any statistical significance/confidence values for your conclusions, what are they?
     
    #22     Oct 1, 2006
  3. ummm..some people use the ADX indicator to keep them out of chop...but I guess you know that...

    This is what you do...run your automation on the simulator and get it to report to you what your ADX 14 values are at the time the trigger is pulled. See if you can find some relationships, correlations...or Holy Grail crumbs :)...

    Ohhh....how much money I could lose if I were a programmer and an automator...but thats just me...please no replies as to how biased and unfair this post was to this forum...

    Michael B.
     
    #23     Oct 1, 2006
  4. billp

    billp

    Newbie2006,

    I must say I'm impressed that that you know about delta thing even though you just started. Wished I was that advanced when I first started out.

    BTW, what software are you using to do the calculations?

    Ok, for my calculation :

    Trades at ask or above ask= +ve delta and vice versa
    For trades b/w bid & ask--the software will somehow allocate them to either bid or ask (maybe based on previous quote), but I think the difference should be immaterial.

    The type of stocks you selected are pretty similar to mine.

    Not sure what you mean by not resetting the market delta variable. I take it to mean that the definition remains the same?

    The logic for market trending up= more aggressive buyers and number keeps getting higher if trend is maintained and vice versa does make sense. However, somehow my limited sample size does not necessarily agree with the above logic. In fact it seems that I can't really make a consistent and frequently occuring strategy out of this general logic.

    1 of the main thing that I tend to agree with my sample size is that generally there is a positive bias on delta.

    Question :You mentioned that if the delta is around 30% of the average volume needed to move the stock one cent, you will consider it as marketdelta being zero? Can you elaborate how you come out with the 30%? Thanks.

    Well, at least this is my experience with delta. Hope this helps.


     
    #24     Oct 1, 2006
  5. billp,
    please see my comments below

     
    #25     Oct 1, 2006
  6. Travis you are doing well with your analysis. There are a few more things you may want to add so you can have 70% accuracy or better in predicting these days. I cant tell you everything, but you may also want to check out the average true range. As far as day of week analysis, you have to be careful because the market is organic. Six years ago, mondays were the best for a trending day, but the past few years it has been wednesdays. But it is a nice feature to use as confirmation and synergy. You may just want to give it a lower ranking. You could also create a matrix with all the inputs and weight them accordingly to establish a clear bias of what the probabilities are for the day.
     
    #26     Oct 1, 2006
  7. travis

    travis

    Thanks, apex. I will keep in mind what you are saying.
     
    #27     Oct 2, 2006
  8. flip

    flip

    hi everybody, my first post here on ET.

    as i have done quite a bit of research regarding trendDays, range, etc., i’ll post some findings in the hope to provide a basis for further discussion, comments and research ideas.

    i analysed the sp500 future from 1990 to 2004 (so i have an out-of-sample period beginning with 2005).
    first, i calculated the “trendiness” of each bar which is defined as: (abs(open-close))/(high-low). this gives a value between 0 and 1. for instance, a doji would have a value near zero. a day that opens at the low and closes at the high would have a value of 1 (the same is true for the opposite, a day that opens at the high and closes at the low).

    a trendDay is then defined as follows:

    trendiness > 0.70
    range > average range of the last 10 days

    on average, 16.5% of all days are trendDays according to the above definition, the average trendiness of all bars was 0.471. the average high – low range was 1.34% over this time period.

    the next step was to find conditions which have an influence on the trendiness, the range and the probability for a trendDay.

    some interesting results:

    the range is higher when prices decline. for instance, when the close is below the EMA(100), the average range is 1.74% on the next day (1261 observations), when the close is above this moving average the avg.range is only 1.14% (2522 obs). so this is a difference of more than 50%. with a p-value of 0 and a t-value of 23.4 (!) this difference is significant at all levels.

    the same effect is visible when using a short term RSI over 5 days:

    RSI between / avg.range / # of observations
    0 – 25 / 1.9% / 302
    25 – 50 / 1.5% / 1306
    50 – 75 / 1.2% / 1613
    75 – 100 / 1.0% / 563

    while there are many effects that change the expectation for tomorrows range, the trendiness is rather difficult to forecast. using the above condition with the EMA(100), a close below the moving average increases the expectation for tomorrows trendiness (0.488) while a close above the EMA decreases it to 0.463. though this difference is significant from a statistical point of view (p-value 0.01, t-value 2.7) it is very small and probably only of little value when it comes to trading.

    overall, after testing ~ 250 different conditions, the forecast for the trendiness ranges only from 0.515 to 0.435. interestingly, both the highest and the lowest value include weekday effects. if today is an upThrustDay (close above yesterdays high) and tomorrow is friday, the expected trendiness is 0.435. on the contrary, if the next day is monday and the market made 2 consecutive lower closes the expected trendiness for monday is 0.515. however, there are only 207 observations for the first condition and 164 for the second. and as previously mentioned, weekday effects might change rather often.


    another interesting thing regarding trendiness and trendDays is the following observation:

    while the average trendiness increases only slightly after 1 or 2 days with a low trendiness, the probability for a trendDay increases after 1 day with a trendiness below 0.30 to 19.2%, after 2 consecutive days with a trendiness below 0.30 it increases to 21.2%. this means that on average the trendiness remains small on most days, but at the same time the probability for a trendDay increases.
     
    #28     Oct 2, 2006
  9. man

    man

    not bad for a first time poster ... :)
     
    #29     Oct 2, 2006
  10. Prevail

    Prevail Guest

    flip, keep those numbers coming. it sounds like predicting those 16 percent trend days is still elusive.
     
    #30     Oct 2, 2006