while the nyse does offer the ability of price improvement, you can also get filled on the other side of that print if you market in at the wrong time.. ever get "spreaded"? no single market maker is able to "gap" a nasdaq stock.. on the NYSE the specialist is given an order for 80k shares.. if he decides to print all 80k in a single print he sweeps all of the orders in his book until he has the full 80k and then makes a single print for all orders in his book at the price least favorable to the big block.. on the nasdaq, a market maker is given an order for 80k.. since the nasdaq is fragmented, he does not know at what price he will be able to acquire 80k shares.. so, being careful not to run the price up on himself, he begins acquiring shares slowly at the market.. when he has the full 80k, he then prints a block trade for 80k at an average(or negotiated) price plus whatever markup.. actually, a seller can call gsco or msco who will negotiate a large print for them.. the difference being that the nasdaq market maker isnt going to slap the market down .70 to fill the order.. he is going to take his time(he isnt responsible for every share traded in the stock) and get the best price.. plus i would like to point out that the orders in the specialists book do not represent the entire market for a nyse stock.. there are always people waiting in the wings for their opportunity to get in and out of a stock.. so with the naz, there is more opportunity to feel around and get a better price.. think about it this way.. if the nyse block trade system were really efficient for the person buying or selling the block, then why would the stocks price move back up near its previous level right after printing the block? level 2 is not quite so useless.. but you cant rely on idiotic "if the colors are moving counter clockwise, then buy" nonsense.. it takes time and experience to learn how to read it.. btw don.. (and i know you already know this, but just forgot) market makers are not allowed to back away from quotes with supersoes.. so you can rely on the sizes that are displayed actually, a nasdaq trader is able to participate in the 200k plus prints.. on the nyse, the specialist combines all of the smaller orders on his book and consolidates everything to a single large print.. on the nasdaq, the market maker first acquires the shares in the market in small pieces.. once he has the needed amount, he then prints the block to the buyer/seller.. so you are able to participate, but in the smaller pieces, rather than in the large block.. lol.. 2 bucks on 50k? which illiquid stock are you referring to? there are stocks on the nasdaq that trade millions of shares a day and dont even move a dollar.. the nyse does have many advantages but i cant help but feel after reading this thread that its benefits might have been slightly exaggerated.. you wont get significant "price improvement" on every trade with the nyse.. and its not impossible to participate in block prints on the nasdaq.. anyway, i thought i would throw in my own .02 in defense of the naz.. -qwik
My personal experience with using NX orders is that while they usually result in close to instant fills, if the specialist is showing stock available but there is not actually any there, using an NX order will just result in the quote being updated. Also they often will just show a 1X1 which as I understand it means they have no obligation to fill you. All of the details are listed at the NYSE web site. DarynC
Don't be fooled by negotiated MM trades or Institution trades that "print" on Inca (other ECN's too, but Inca especially). Remember what INCA stands for (Instinet or "Institutional Network")...and they put up their own trades between firms (at way to high a cost, but that's another story).
I've traded a few different stocks. Since I am now doing arbitrage with some indexes and such I would prefer to not disclose what I am trading (more traders doing arbitrage means less opportunity for me) I have traded DIS, F , MO, CCU, IBM, LU, AK, and a few others. Robert Tharp
Different specialist do differnt things. This is where knowing how a specialists handles orders like NX come into play. I know a few who do exactly what you say. I also have played with a lot of others who show 1x1 but I can hit him with 2000 shares and he will give me all of them.
All NYSE stocks now have it. FRE seems to have found a way to ignore it though as per my experience with him. Some stocks it's great with the instant fills and there are times I can get a lot more than the 100 lot they sometimes show. It depends on the stock/specialist how they choose to fill them. It has made NYSE trading much easier--but quite a few specialist have stopped showing size. Decimals also hurt as lots of traders will penny the specialist with a 100 lot so we have a hard time knowing what the true depth of the market is. Robert Tharp
Leland; Are you the one that used to trade at Polar Trading in Mi? If so, email me privately as i'd be happy to hear from you!! Pej.