Jane Street- Usually considered the best. SIG- From what I gather this is the 2nd best, but I don't know big they are in NYC. Most people seem to work in Philly. Trillium Trading- Pays $500 a week I believe, not as much as Jane Street or SIG, but much better than nothing. Chimera Securities- Does not pay during training period, but pays salary after training period. FNYS- Considered one of the best, at least a couple of years ago, but I heard on WSO they were going under. I don't know how true this is. Any others?
Thanks. I emailed Transmarket Group to ask if they have junior trader positions in New York. I get the impression from their website that they are only in Chicago. Hold Brothers is in New York. I'm emailing them to see if they take people who want to begin a career in trading and train them.
with the CBSX firms, discretionary trading positions usually aren't paid. most deposit a require. You can still check these firms to see if anything is available in risk/administration/back-office. I know quite a few traders who ended up finding employment in back-office positions after being unable to trade their own capital successfully. Either way, there are positions and you can learn the business the good old fashioned way while getting a salary. It's going to be very difficult to find discretionary trading that is fully-backed, let alone with a salary. Most places that offer this have a very distinctive style that can't be implemented at another firm. Trading firms are often structured around a particular strategy/style of trading. I think a back-office gig can get you the experience you need to know what you're doing trading.
Many of the firm OP mentioned, offer the old trainee/assistant/junior way to start working with them. Specially chicago ones, oh, btw OP, you should add Tower Hill to your list, forgot about them. A serious Prop firm will never let you play your capital for a couple of obvious reasons and will pay all the software expenses (at least until the preparation period is done). I really doubt that the rate of success of their traders would be higher if they made their trainees pay 300/month plus the risk capital. All those "prop firms" that are active in ET, are just trading arcades and bucket shops where the owners mostly are under-capitalized themselves, and just will "hire" their profitable traders without putting a cent to their training, managing, selection, etc earning the money from the commissions and software fees spread. They mostly don´t know how to trade themselves, so to not leave the stock market, they go and open a sub-account at WTS, HB, etc and try to earn a living milking out their "traders" lol.
that's a very big misconception. A lot of prop firm owners are very successful themselves. Many traders, myself included, choose to trade discretionary because the payouts are higher and the commissions are lower. if you knew you were profitable, would you rather keep nearly all of your profits or give half of it away? the no-capital upfront model is mostly for people who can't sustain themselves independently and need some type of downside. I hate to put it that way, but that seems to be the major difference between the two. The success rate is much more dependent on the trader and their skill set than any training program. Nobody can train you to perceive the market, you have to learn to see it through your own eyes. If you're using a firm's strategy it's going to be difficult to walk away and start trading that elsewhere. There's 2 sides to every coin. not to be rude, but it is a bit naive to think all the traders at discretionary trading firms are at a bucket shop. I bet some of the firms you mentioned have just as much if not more 6-7 figure traders.
There are definitely plenty of firms in Chicago, but I'm specifically interested in firms located in NYC right now. That's why I did not include Tower Hill. I did however see that DRW has trader assistant positions in New York. I just applied there as well and would add them to the list, but ET doesn't allow me to edit my post now.
I understand your point of view, but I was talking about the entry level traders. For a trader that already know the way of trading it´s profitable to go that way, sometimes, if comparing with retail account for example. But for lets say people who wanna trade for a living and just ended college, there is no better opportunity. I mean, they don´t have the money, nor the time, nor the idea about what is needed to trade. And those prop firms with 50/50 splits most, are a perfect opportunity. They will have them controlled, will find their flaws, assign them already profitable traders to mold their market perception. Plus, most of these firms trade a number of different markets and instruments, spreads, credits, fx, global exchanges, commodities, etc, much of those markets offers far greater opportunities for traders than equities, specially in those times. I mean, you would not find a better place to learn to trade, ever.
I agree with most, if not all, of what you said, but a lot of times if you flop or even manage under 3k/day (gross) in a bucket shop and go back to the other world where you need downside, people really look down upon you. The way they reason it, they think you're a dummy who doesn't know how truly competitive the markets are. I dislike it, but that's the way people look at you. So there's that limbo zone where you make money, but not enough to make a killing, and where you have to focus on your own growth and go independent.
There is a reason there are at least 20 posts just like this...and the reason is that these positions don't really exist. And if they do they are very difficult to get. First, you definitely need an advanced college degree and probably one from a top or Ivy league school. Second, you will be given intense math exams and need to score in the 99th percentile. And third, you need to be on their trading floor...so most of these positions are in NY or Chicago. I'm not saying it's impossible...just improbable. And to call the prop model where you put up your own money a "bucket shop" is ridiculous. That's like saying E-Trade or Scottrade is a bucket shop. There is no difference except at a prop firm you pay less and can get more BP and don't have to deal with PDT rule (although you might have a profit split). And to also say they are ran by failed traders is also thoughtless. For example, the principles of Bright and Hold were (and might still be) excellent traders. Everyone wants something for nothing. If you want a trading job at a top firm get a degree (preferably and MBA or PHD) in finance or mathematics at a top school...otherwise, save up enough capital and fund an account. TD