Prop firms and position trades?

Discussion in 'Prop Firms' started by mlarsen, Jan 9, 2003.

  1. mlarsen


    Does anyone know that if a trader can show some serious results position trading, will some of these proprietary firms allow a trader to take 1-3 day+ positions, as long as the risk is managed properly.

    My comfort zone is in the daily timeframes, and I am very good at what I do. There can be several days that go by where I don't trade a position and wait for the right entry point. But when I do get in the trades are very profitable.

    Or are these proprietary firms for daytrading only?

    Thanks for any help

    PS ETG looks like an interesting firm possibly.
  2. SamW


    ECHOtrade will permit this type of trading, subject to compliance with their risk guidelines.
  3. i work at ETG, and if you make money, you can do whatever you want. options, overnights, etc. if you have any questions, feel free to ask. i know worldco discourages it, while i can't see why firms like echo and bright, which require a deposit, would have a problem with it. so, you may want to look into those if willing to risk your own money.
  4. cashonly

    cashonly Bright Trading, LLC

    As long as the risk is managed, Bright doesn't have any problem with this.

  5. alanm


    I remember a Hold Brothers guy at a trade show showing me his statement. It was a veritable graveyard of positions that he was probably waiting on to start going the right direction :)
  6. thesage


    Dafugginman, are you still at ETG? Are any of the original traders still there? I am wondering why unless they don´t have the money. Basically, a trader is giving up a 1/4 to 1/2 of the upside and paying in effect 1/3 to 1/2 more in commission than they have to. I don´t know but when you do the math it just doesn´t make sense in todays current environment. Also, the ISLD rebates were never given to traders, some people make a living off this. This is an additional disappearing rebate that goes to the house. It adds up believe me. I heard they charge .03 a share for bullets too.
  7. i'm still here. i imagine ETG still holds their reserve accounts. however, management is finally adopting a different strategy to keep and attract traders. they switched clearing firms, away from SLK and Susquehanna (bullets), who have among, if not the highest clearing charges in the industry, and is passing along the savings to remain competitive.

    commissions dropped to no higher than a penny, beginning january 1, which is also when the reserve account was eliminated. a new bullet schedule was supposed to be out last week, so it should be out very soon.

    the payout is still 10-15% lower than peers (if you make less than 500k), although you are risking the firm's money, not your own, so you have to figure that you're going to pay for some of those that couldn't make it. ETG gave me a shot, so i have a sense of loyalty that many other prop traders here, and elsewhere, do not. maybe when my contract is up and i'm willing to risk my own money, i will consider leaving for a better payout.
  8. thesage


    Did you ever wonder why it took so long to lower rates? Have you ever calculated your additional expense? Most of the traders at ETG are too scared to leave as they have been threatened with lawsuits, that´s the real reason. Fear rules that firm. ETG is good for a start, but when you have the money there is really no other reason to stay other than fear.
  9. like i said, it took them so long because their costs are higher than self clearing firms (andover and worldco and hold to name a few). bright had lower rates on the same system, but you have to plunk down 25k. it is the same reason generic's are high - SLK's clearing costs are high.

    the people that haven't either have capital here or a sense of loyalty, like me. plenty of people left since i started, and none of them have been sued. but, they should be.

    if you sign a contract, you should honor it. if you think it's unfair, then you shouldn't of signed it in the first place. plus, these people wouldn't be traders at all if ETG didn't give them a shot. it's no different then some athlete signing a 3 year contract for 5 million, then seeing someone the following year gets a 6 million contract, so the former athlete refuses to play. that's bullshit, and this is no different. don't sign the contract in the first place if you don't like the terms.

    sure, now they know how to trade so other firms are then willing to take them, but NONE of these other firms would've gave them a shot before, and none of the traders respect that. it makes me nautious when i hear people talk around here.

    my deal, that came about january first for all traders here, is fine, and i'm not going to whore myself for an extra tenth of a cent like 99% of the other prop traders do. i'll play out the contract, then see. this is my probable deal; 80% (assuming i hit my goal), .8, and $20 bullets. after that, i'll probably get class b, then get a percent of the firms profits, if they have any. they don't self clear, and don't require you to risk your own money, and offer 10% return on any money you leave in your account (which i think many people would kill for). i think that is competitive enough for a firm that doesn't require money down and doesn't self clear, no?
  10. I have nothing really new to add, just want to clarify something. When you start with ETG you are not risking your own money, but when you are profitable and have money in the capital account, that money is at risk, so you are in fact risking your own money. So there is no personal risk at the beginning, but as you grow and become profitable you share in the risk to the extent of your profit and loss split.
    #10     Jan 14, 2003