pristine esp VS tradeseeker

Discussion in 'Trading Software' started by badger, Dec 8, 2001.

  1. badger


    Hi I would like to know your opinion regarding these two software titles. At the moment im using pristine esp which seems much better than tradeseeker. at least it generates more alerts and its free.
    Does anybody have any other experiences?
    your comments and strategies would be appreciated.
  2. I'm having problems with ESP disconnecting a lot. I have a DSL line which has been very reliable so I don't know why ESP keeps disconnecting. Also, I adjusted my filters to only show alerts for NYSE stocks, but I still get a lot of NASDAQ alerts.....

    Where can I get Tradeseeker?
  3. badger


    you can get tradeseeker at it cost for all versions something around 90$ per month. When i took a trial it gave me only a couple alerts per hour and all of them were not reliable. I gave a call to sales rep and he said that market is not volatile thats why i dont get alerts. Maybe somebody had other experiences?
  4. EricP


    The TradeSeeker software generates over one thousand real time alerts per day, ranging from new days highs/low to the triggering of alerts on sophisticated trading strategies. Because of this, I recommend users only enable the strategies that most interest them, in order to reduce the 'noise' of alerts from unwanted strategies.

    The TradeSeeker software has an ever-growing list of over 50+ realtime alerting strategies and over 120+ scans. Note that these alerts and scans will link directly into your RT3 display. However, note that RT3 is not a requirement for the TradeSeeker software.

    A two week free trial for TradeSeeker is available at:

    More general information, including an online tutorial, can also be found at:

    I would be glad to answer any TradeSeeker specific questions that anyone may have.

    Best of luck,
  5. sorry, don't like it....

    Pristine's model is tantamount to avoidance of responsibility. The commentators in their trading rooms are not paid staff but associated individuals who represent loosely Pristine, although there's no monetary compensation to their calls or participation. This leaves a gaping whole in the philosphy of participation in their chat rooms. These rooms charge upwards of $285 monthly and far more. Simply put if the moderators are not compensated from the company, then unless they maintain RA status (Registered Advisor status from the SEC, similar to Series 7 licensing) then what safeguard does one have regarding "pumping and dumping" any security that's "called" on for a particular trade, at that particular time?

    Cavet Emptor? Following that line of reasoning, then, the ESP trade scanning software, which is quite elaborate, and I can explain its programmatic concept, but that gets into a few paragraphs. The software basically uses a publish and subscribe client server model. The server does the analysis in real time, and takes up quite a bit of bandwidth and clock cycles. Simply put, its not your ordinary desktop computer. This server application identifies just about every movement in the stock market for each of the three exchanges, as categorized by the Pristine Buy/Sell setups.

    The flaw with this exists on two levels:
    1) because every stock goes through multiple dimensions of trade patterns in a normal trading day, then one stock has the unlimited potential of generating a tremendous number of flags, or conditions or "monitored triggers".
    2) if you, on the other hand, answer the question of: "what should I trade next?" with the answer: "all stocks or any specific stock", then you will always be able to claim that your system is/was right 100% of the time.

    Take this to the next extent and force fit your selected calls after the fact, compile them into an advertisement and claim that your system generated 85% correct calls 90% of the time, and no one can ever disprove you. Until you put your money to the table and expect that the same software will produce such pure and refined calls, yet again, and especially for you. Then you remember the phrase that was in the software licensing agreement that goes something like this:

    "past performance is not indicitive of future results";
    "all trades entered into are your responsibility and we except no liability for your trading desicions or actions".

    So, I will ask you, what do you think of Prisine ESP or TradeSeeker.

    BTW, those comments are 85% correct 90% of the time, and apply to 100% of the "so-called" trade finding software
  6. limitdown,

    Both ESP and TradeSeeker are simply scanners. That means they go over kilobytes or megabytes of data and find in it whatever you are looking for, kind of like a search engine. You ask them to find all stock the price of which is above $20 and volume above 200,000, and it finds that, you ask for stock that is approaching resistance, and it finds that, you ask for a stock that matches a certain pattern that you think usually means the stock will go up, and it finds that. In short, a scanner is not a particular trading system, it is simply a piece of software that automates the simple task of searching what you are looking for, and performs such searches obviously much faster than you could do them yourself.

    I suppose your comments on success rates would not be off topic if the scanner was limited to doing very specific searches that would make it useless for anything but a very specific set of trading strategies. Seems to me that would still just be a broken scanner.


    Didn't you write both ESP and TradeSeeker? What's the difference between them, and how come you are no longer supporting ESP?

  7. EricP



    Yes, my company developed the ESP software in conjunction with Pristine. Unfortunately, my business and Pristine was unable to resolve a number of issues, and so we had to shutdown the use of the product by their clients. Subsequently, Pristine has attempted to 'recreate' the product on their own, with marginal success. I believe their software developer left their company months ago, which explains why their product is only partially functional and has been in 'beta' test mode for 8+ months.

    The TradeSeeker product is fully functional and supported by Teach Me To Trade. We have recently released version 4.0.2 of the product and are continually making improvements to the software.

    You are correct that their are quite a few similarities in the two products. While I will admit to being biased... probably the biggest differences are as follows:

    1) TradeSeeker does not REQUIRE Real Tick III in order to receive scans and alerts. This is a requirement for ESP.
    2) TradeSeeker has a much larger list of available scans and alerts than ESP. Also, note that new scans and alerts are being added to TradeSeeker, which is apparently not the case with ESP.
    3) TradeSeeker is a live product, with client support and ongoing product improvements being added. The ESP product is apparently still available for testing, but has no support and it does not appear that any improvements have been made in 8+ months to actually allow release of this product, nor does it appear that any improvements are in progress.
    4) TradeSeeker now has over 1000+ authorized users and is a key tool being used by numerous active traders and investors on a daily basis. My impression is that the ESP product is used very infrequently, even by Pristine in-house traders and employees.
    5) The TradeSeeker software requires virtually no CPU or bandwidth to operate. A five year old computer with a 14.4 modem is more than sufficient, since all of the 'work' is done on the server side. As a result, the TradeSeeker alerts are definitely provided 'realtime.' In other words, you will receive a "New 52 Week High" alert, for example, within one second or less of when the trade printed on the T&S. I'm not sure of the speed of the ESP product, whether realtime or delay. I do know that when I pull up "Show Advice" for an ESP alert, it often takes 30+ seconds to get the response back from the server, and even then the response is often related to some alert from five months ago. I'm sure this is just another bug, but they've apparently go no one working on fixing or improving the product.

    Certainly, I am biased in my opinion. The best bet is for people to give them a test drive and see how they like the product. I would be glad to answer any questions you may have on the TradeSeeker product. Perhaps someone reading this thread has tried out the ESP product and can provide better feedback on it. Also, I welcome comments and feedback related to TradeSeeker.

    Best of luck,
  8. I wasn't sure whether explaining the falicy in reliance upon scanners, not as a trading methodology, but as they are represented and marketed, and then excused by the lenghtly worded contract as just that, a falicy.

    yes, scanners, in general do scan... however, whence sniping trades and the like, as pro's do, usage of a scanner frees up brain clock cycles and relocates them to the desktop. Many traders, that I've observed, cursed the day that they lost control of their decision making processes to a scanner, whether ESP, the other one or First Alert or otherwise.

    Frequently, just watching CNBC or CNNFn will do the active scanning function in a manner that is more sureal and provides at least fundamental news backup to the assertions that a particular stock is worth intraday trading.

    I fault the dualilty of the scanning software craze, and especially ESP as it is one of the foremost in complexity.

    Whence I monitored it in real time, it would frequently notify me of far too many trades, even whence I slowed down and narrowed the search bandwidth to just, say, 12 pre-sets. Even then, the T1 bandwidth and software of the charts were too slow to jump over to the stock that just flashed on the trigger.

    1) Given that the event has to occur first, then get noticed by the screening software on the server side, and then be placed and categorized in its trigger pattern (incidently, one event can be categorized in numerous trigger pattern events)
    2) your connection speed and subscribe portion of the publish and subscribe equation has to receive the notification that an event has triggered
    3) you have to watch for each new entry on the notification list
    4) adjust your screening software and charting software to go observe the chart, make allocation decisions and finally a Buy/ No-Buy decision

    The problem with these scenarios is that these software Screeners have -2min predictive abilities. If these are trend followers, as such, then following an existing event (by definition being a one time event) is not the same as Momemtum trading (essentially following a trend).

    Trend following screeners would be more profitable to most traders and less suspect to market manipulation even during violent trading periods.

    If my thesis seems logical, then let the chorus sing....
  9. Turok


    Discloser: I have no knowledge of either of the software programs being discussed, and thus am responding only in a general sense.

    >Even then, the T1 bandwidth and software of the
    >charts were too slow to jump over to the stock that
    >just flashed on the trigger

    I have programmed my own scanner, and I found the above also to be true *ONLY* if attempting to trade a scalping time frame. By moving my intraday time frame out to a 13 minute chart or beyond, I now have plenty of time to absorb and enter.

  10. Chipdude



    I have some TC2000 scans like stocks breaking out of a 7 week base on Volume twice that of 50 day moving average volume.
    I would love to run this scan realtime. Can I do it in tradeseeker ?
    What feeds does tradeseeker support ?

    #10     Aug 24, 2002