understand the advantages of having non-native orders. There are quite a few, but just to name a few: - Savings in exchange fees for order replace / cancels etc (as applicable) - Non-visibility / stealth to other market participants / i.e. you're not in the actual order book / depth. Particularly doing large size or stocks. - Non-execution of extreme short-term adverse price-spikes / volatility. Basically, you're less likely to get stopped out for "bogus" fakeouts. Give or take, there are quite a lot of reasons out there to use non-native stops. I'm sure you could start a whole new thread about it! Scientist
Doing so now..... I'm deleting the posts that blatantly attack one another. In some cases, I've deleted paragraphs that do so and tried to retain portions of posts that are on subject. We moderators do this for free, and no, I'm not online all weekend long.... Keep the posts on subject and stop the personal attacks. My sense right now is that the poll counts seem to be important (for some reason...), in which case I'll be forced to shut down this thread/poll if these continue.
Well, I don't use any; I've written my own. I have been interested in what these are all about, and I am enjoying the detail that many of the posts are providing.
SCIENTIST... your last post raises an interesting point. i love to use bracket orders BUT using them during economic reports is NO GOOD. TWO DIFFERENT TIMES i got stopped out of "winning trades" because of those ridulous up/down sweeping spikes the moment the news comes out. technology is good but gotta understand how it works.
No.Mistake. One think is how the universe react ( vote) in a poll, another thing is that that very same universe is not maybe aware of the "not completely trustable" data coming from IB. Which is not completely fault of IB: ASOF the exchanges has diffrent modes to deliver data to brokers and Data providers. However I believe that the doiscussion at this point is worth less since ha staken too personal. Each one will use the one that makes him feel in the most comfortable way. Than the market eventually will vote. Came down everybody , do not get in overtrading and have a very good , profitable day.
Which would you prefer? To continue the discussion about native vs non-native orders: I agree with Scientist that there are times when a person may want to use non-native orders or 'simulated' orders. For example, NinjaTrader has a bunch of features that are great tools for order entry/exit/trade management which are 'simlulated' orders at the price you want them to trigger. I know that some of the other front-end products also have similar advanced features. These tools can have you shave an extra tick on entry/exit ...stay in a trade when you would otherwise have been stopped out, etc. These are all valid tools with valid trading logic behind them, which a great many people appreciate. The developers of these front-end programs did us all a huge favour. If you have only traded via the TWS window, you will marvel at how you can now trade with one of these programs. Just be informed enough to know that ALL non native orders (whether they be held on IB servers or simulated by an IB front-end program) carry the additional risk of you getting creamed if you have local PC problems or IB server problems at precisely the wrong moment i.e. when you expect your order to get filled! For this reason, I stick only to natively held Stop-Limit orders when trading ES/NQ. They are sitting at Globex and are safe. Not to mention timestamped and queued ready for filling ahead of the guys using non-native orders at the same price. Simulated orders in a front-end product have their use. But in my opinion, simply using the plain (colour blue) stop orders held on IB servers have no benefit whatsoever and only carry additional risk. The guys using the free front-end product "TSim+" are only ever using plain IB server-held stop orders for the ES/NQ. By not having the ability to use stop-limits they are doing nothing but increasing their risk, and they don't even get the benefit of the simulated features used by other products. It's the worst of all worlds. Get creamed just ONCE when the market blasts through your plain IB stop order and doesn't get executed. Then come back and see whether you want to use stop-limits next time! Like everything in life, you get what you pay for. TSim+ is free. If you're an active index futures trader, then it likely isn't good enough because it only uses IB server held stop orders and doesn't offer the possibility of a stop-limit order. In my opinion, it's better to pay for a quality product and get the features and service that you need. NinjaTrader is my favourite but that's just my 2 cents.
OK we have a point that is generally agreed upon: Non-native orders bear certain risks to be aware of. It's crucial to be fully aware of your order options! Also, you need to make sure you know what your platform features, because not all platforms feature both options! My favorite TWS execution plugins in personal order of preference would be: 1. BT (simply most versatile, professional, inexpensive and excellent, doesn't crash), 2. AT (AutoTrader is free and pretty good, even has playback feature!), 3. FT (Futures-Trader isn't free, but a low one-off fee and excellent) 4. NT (Ninja is simple, effective and reliable I'd say, good product) 5. IB TWS - Might as well... Good programmability for hotkeys etc... Fine for longer-term trading. We could all post some hotlists, to see what each player's personal rankings of preference are. Peace, Scientist.
I read in one of the posts here that there an issue of increased cost due to cancelling a native globex order? Which Futures brokerage charges for this? Maybe I was dreaming this and my senality has set in, because I cannot find this post anymore. Michael B.