Poker and the Beginning Trader

Discussion in 'Psychology' started by FanOfFridays, Jan 3, 2003.

  1. Hey, if any of you guys are looking to get into online poker I have set up a website where it shows some sites that offer free no deposit money to try it out. Also I have a list of the best freerolls where you just need to register an account without paying and you can enter them.
    The website is www.SharkBait72.com
     
    #701     Jan 24, 2006
  2. Well, according to my buddies at FullTilt poker, the sheer increase in number of players (mostly newer players) has made it somewhat easier for the more experienced when trading online. One lady friend of mine said that Party Poker actually thought she was a computer program (because of her win rate), and now sends out periodic passwords that she must type in to continue in a game.

    If you think about it...add a million players overall, of which perhaps 10% are "good" - not bad odds. But, at the same time, there will be 100,000 more "good" players to avoid.

    Always label your opponents, with player notes...it really helps you to avoid the better players (don't let ego get involved in poker or trading).

    All the best,

    Don
     
    #702     Jan 25, 2006
  3. Hank, is that you playing John D'Agostino heads up on Full Tilt for high money right NOW???

    Hank, you are a roller, my man.

    Or is it someone else with the name Rearden Metal?? How likely is that?
     
    #703     Mar 11, 2006
  4. ewile

    ewile

    I can't believe this thread is still going. It has outlived my trading aspirations but not my poker obsession.
     
    #704     Mar 12, 2006
  5. Holy shit?! Are you kidding me? No it's not me, I haven't been dealt a hand in almost a year... and I'm surprised there's another high rolling Rearden Metal out there!

    Could you ask this character if he knows me, or if he just picked the name the same way I did (Just reading Atlas Shrugged)? Thanx!
     
    #705     Mar 12, 2006
  6. Yep, he had your exact name spelled exactly the same way and he sat down with 20K to play D'Agostino heads up. There were a bunch of guys watching (presumably because it was D'Agostino) and some of them were trying to ask this other RM a few questions but he wouldn't respond.

    He must have been reading Rand too :)

    If I see him again I'll ask him.
     
    #706     Mar 12, 2006

  7. Actually #11 completely untrue.
    Winning poker pros all play a very similar style...
    They all know the math cold...
    And play semi-tight/hyper-aggressive...
    Tending to play the opponent(s)... not the cards.

    #12 is also wrong.

    In a strict sense... there is no "correct" move in poker.
    If you win the pot... your move was "correct"...
    If you lose... your move was "not correct".

    That's why computers cannot simulate poker well...
    Because the "wrong" play in the form of a bluff or whatever... often wins the pot.

    Correctness is purely retrospective...
    And depends as much on your read of your opponents... as your cards.

    Also... the worst hand at the table is the 2nd best hand.

    You sound like someone who's played 10 hours of poker...
    As opposed to 10,000 hours.

    The place to go is 2+2 Forums.
    Very sharp people over there...

    IMO, the successful young poker pros moving up...
    Are more talented than the day trading crowd here...
    And have a better grasp of the math/stats as applied to zero sum games.

    rm+

    :cool: :cool: :cool:
     
    #707     Mar 13, 2006
  8. While this point is not without merit, that's also how many fish commonly justify (to themselves), staying in hands which should be folded.

    "I'm not foolishly drawing to a 2-outer, I'm <i>mixing up my play.</i>" :D

    P.S. Regarding your aggressive comments toward TraderNik, you should back up your words with your cash. Play him in a series of medium/high stakes freezeouts, and see how you do...
     
    #708     Mar 13, 2006
  9. Hey Redman

    Thanks for your comments. The first thing you should do is check the date on that initial post. As I said, I had only played a few hours of poker at that time. It was just a post to generate some discussion about beginners in trading and what we could learn from Hold-Em. I tried to make that clear.
    Is that a fact? Hmmm... well now. Let's compare the style of 'Action' Dan Harrington with that of Gus Hansen. Would you say that these two great pros have a similar style? The idea that good players 'tend to play the opponents and not the cards' is from the first chapter of Poker 101. Kind of like saying 'The early bird gets the worm'. Everyone knows that's true. There's another pro that was featured on the WSOP last year and the guy was just as loose as a cannon. He was raising shit cards from early position, and calling guys on the flop and turn with very little in his hand. I can't recall, what the hell was his name...I think it was Layne Flack. Try going over to twoplustwo and posting that you think Layne and Dan play similar styles.

    Secondly, I was not talking about pros in that post. I was talking about the players I saw online.
    This is not always true and potentially misleading to anyone learning the game. In poker, the idea is to induce mistakes in your opponent's play, often by controlling the pot odds that he is getting to make a call against you. If you induce a call in a situation in which your opponent has paid too much relative to the size of the pot he can possibly win, he has made a mistake, and you have made a winning play. The correct ratio of 'call amount' to pot size is determined by the odds that his hand will be the best in the end. It doesn't matter what the outcome of that particular hand is. You could lose and your move was absolutely correct and you will take it all day long. If you get all your money in as a favourite, you have made the correct play, at least in cash games. I have read some authors who feel that there are certain situations in tournament play when other factors need to be assessed, but as far as I can tell, this rule holds true for almost any tournament situation. Certainly Harrington thinks so, and he's not a bad player.

    This is why people get on Phil Hellmuth so much. He knows that whenever he takes a bad beat, he has been involved in the exact situation he sat down to find, and yet he complains about it.
    Again, it doesn't matter. If a player bluffs, and is called by a player with the best of it, and the bluffer wins, the caller will take that all day long and has made no mistake. It is the bluffer that has made a mistake.

    Sometimes you get away with your mistakes, sometimes you don't.
    Purely? Far from it. There are plenty of situations in which you can be 100% sure that you are ahead at the moment or that you have your opponent beat. If you have KK, and you raise preflop, you get one caller and the flop comes K 8 2 rainbow, you know you are ahead, and if you bet properly and induce a call from the caller with i.e. A8 offsuit, you are correct. In fact there is no hand which your opponent can have that makes him a favourite at this time. You can calculate his worst possible holding (from your perspective) and base your betting on that. Retrospect is not needed. So correctness is clearly not purely retrospective.

    I would suggest reading both of Dan Harrington's books. He describes the different styles of the pros he has faced. There is also a detailed explanation of the idea of inducing mistakes in your opponents play. This idea is also the basis for two of the most widely read poker books, David Sklansky's The Theory of Poker and Hold-Em for Advanced Players.
    Again, I wrote that when I was just starting out. Please check the time stamp.
    I think I joined in 2003 - not sure, I'd have to check. It was right around the time of that first post.

    I play exclusively tournaments now because that is my strength. I'll be at a small stakes ($150 buy-in) freeze-out tomorrow night. Again, thanks for your comments, even though some of them weren't accurate.
     
    #709     Mar 17, 2006


  10. Me too. I have been playing poker for half a century and am burnt out on ring games. I love tournaments because every decision is critical which holds my interest.
     
    #710     Mar 17, 2006