otcbb at IB

Discussion in 'Interactive Brokers' started by zdreg, Aug 3, 2006.

  1. zdreg


    IB will not execute orders for opening positions in bulletin board stocks. if the line shows a last price wich is yesterday's closing price and there is no quote IB will accept the order, mark it as live but will not
    execute with the explanation that there is no electronic quote from arca or nite.

    I would appreciate your thoughts
  2. alanm


    How would they execute it if there is no offer to take? I doubt TMBR makes markets in OTCBB stocks. Presumably, if the order shows it is live, it was sent to NITE, but I wouldn't hold your breath waiting for them to work the order manually unless it is significantly mis-priced. You'd probably do better to send it directly to ARCA instead, so the rest of the world can see it.

    This is all just a guess - I don't trade OTCBB.
  3. maxpi


    I had orders sit for days with ARCA while the price traded right past my limit. They don't have to execute anything unless they are trading it too, and they don't. OTC is bullshit, I guess market regulators know that there has to be a bullshit market for people that play games, OTC is it.
  4. alanm


    Yup - that can happen too. I just figured it would be better to have it sit where more people can see it instead of on NITE's internal book, where it will be ignored until (and maybe in spite of!) NITE getting an opposing order.

    As many have said, stay far, far away from OTCBB unless you have a (legal) edge. It's just sick that this marketplace is allowed to continue to exist.
  5. The MMs ignore ARCA - they are trying to delay the fact that they will be replaced by ECNs!
  6. i got executed at amex on my latest trade, [that was yesterday] flawlessly in and out...hmm, dont think was otcbb tho, but it was priced @0.86 [cnr].
  7. mokwit


    Anyone trade TSE Venture?

    Is it quote driven (market makers) or order driven (central book)? I am open eyed to the OTC scam aspect - all those companies with USD200k on the balance sheet doing deals in China, finding oil in Mongolia or discovering a cure for cancer that has eluded multibillion dollar research based drug companies.

    I trade this kind of thing in Asia but it is with a central order book so you can get filled. It seems with OTCBB the only time you get a fill is when you are positioned wrong relative to the guy with all those bids and offers placed through different brokers.
  8. zdreg


    for some otc bb there is an an electronic quote. otherwise nobody sees anything except for nite since as previously stated there is no
    electronic quote. only the priors day's close is shown. sending to arca doesn't help since they don't have an electronic quote either in this particular otcbb stock. if you are closing your position
    IB will execute against some market maker.
    the prior policy at IB was to reject all
    orders of otcbb to open. why the change in policy when they are still not executing against mm to open?
  9. alanm


    To my knowledge, IB routes to ARCAEdge and to NITE (the MM). If there is no electronic quote (on ARCAEdge), and the order is sent to NITE, NITE has to be interested in filling it in order for you to get an execution. If you can see NITE's offer at your limit price on the OTCBB montage, that still does not mean he has to fill you - the quotes are not firm.

    If you see some other MM's offer that you are trying to lift, NITE has to be motivated to pick up the phone and try to negotiate with that MM, and that MM has to be willing to fill better than his offer. For example, if the best offer is 0.25 by MOKE, and you send NITE a buy limit 0.25, you will probably not get filled unless NITE also has inventory he would like to dump at 0.25, because he can't make any money by buying it at 0.25 and selling it to you at the same price.

    If you send a buy limit 0.30, and it's for enough size to make it worthwhile, NITE may call MOKE and try to buy it, probably at a discount to 0.30 so he can flip it to you. If MOKE doesn't want to sell below 0.30, and there is no way for NITE to make any money on the deal, you won't get a fill. MOKE doesn't even have to move his quote, either, as far as I can recall (this may have changed to a fill-or-move rule in recent years).

    If you can give a specific example and a snapshot of the OTCBB L2 montage, it might be useful.