Discussion in 'Trading Software' started by Warrior4g, Apr 19, 2008.
can anyone opine on these two platforms? the pro's and con's.
It is the same thing? Genesis is the broker, and Laser is the software platform they own and use.
I started using Laser over 3 years ago because of all the hype on ET from people saying it is the best platform. I made the switch and regretted it from day one. I have used pretty much every major DMA platform out there over the years. I rank Laser as the worst. It is not a complete software. They started building it with good intentions and then rushed to get it out to traders but never finished building it and after all these years they still never went back to finish it. Unless you are rebate trading or microscalping a stock and all you need is a Level II box and execution, it is fine. But if you need anything beyond a Level II box it doesn't have it. Oh, and if you try to call for technical support, you won't get any.
If you want to use the API good luck! The trader next to me had worked for large hedgefunds writing blackboxes. He said Laser API was worst he had used. The documentation for the API is incomplete and full of errors. And he tried calling Genesis and Serge hundreds of times to have a question anwered only for them to refuse to answer and say they don't support their own API. His blackbox had originally been written for and was working on another platform, and he just had to rewrite it for Laser. But because he couldn't get the correct coding for the API from Genesis he had to do trial and error and test the code by trading and lose money trading to find out what the correct code was.
He also tried to co-locate several of his servers at Genesis, and that was just an unbelievably horrible experience. Serge was questioned numerous ahead of time about being able to use Linux servers, Serge said that you could and it was no problem. He sent the servers, it took Genesis almost 3 months to actually install the servers after they received them despite repeated calling. And then he discovered Genesis was completely window based so his servers were completely useless. He had to send another server that was window based to interact with the other servers and he had to fly to NY for a couple of days to configure and setup his servers to make them work on Windows. And a week after he got back from his trip he still couldn't connect to his servers. He was told that Genesis had moved the servers after he left, and now his setup which he had just flown there to fix was messed up and not working again. So he had to find and pay a Tech guy in the NYC area to go into Genesis to re-setup his servers again to how he had done it himself when he flew to NY because the tech support at Genesis either refuses to help, or isn't educated enough on the subject to help. Then Genesis told him in order to control his servers he needed to use I believe it was Gotomypc software, which is ridiculously slow and disconnects often. The quotes constantly jammed up and stopped letting his servers see the market, so his orders would go out several minutes after they were supposed to when the quotes would catch up and trigger orders even though the market had moved and changed significantly during those minutes. So his orders were being sent out into what the market was 3 minutes ago, instead of what the market currently was. As you can imagine this would cause major losses. And the orders kept going out wrong because of the incorerect API. He spent a lot of money to set this up and lost even more money to the market trying to get the Laser API to work. When he told them he was done and wanted his servers back, they refused to pack up his servers and ship them back, so someone had to go to NYC and individually carry the servers out of Genesis to the nearest UPS store to ship them back. He then switched to the API of another software and is a whole lot happier.
I later realized that all the hype about the Laser software and how great an API they have and how so many traders use it, was just a bunch of BS posted on ET by Genesis aliases and Sub-LLC managers trying to recruit traders and make it sound like they had the best software. Within the past six months I have finally made the complete switch off of Laser onto another software that I am very happy with and which has execution and quote speeds just as fast as Laser.
I currently use Sterling and am very happy, but Assent's Anvil is very good along with Lightspeed, REDI and Greybox are good, Real Tick and Instaquote which were both great about 6 or 7 years ago aren't that good or reliable anymore. LIke I said earlier, Laser is only good if all you need is a Level II box, because it either doesn't have other tools like other platforms, or the very few it does have never really worked and over 3 years later and multiple complaints those very few tools still have not been fixed or completed and still don't work.
I know it seems like I am bashing Genesis and their Laser, but with all the frustration they caused me and those around me over those 3 years, I just had to vent my frustrations and let others know what it was really like for us. And not to believe all the hype posted on ET about Laser. And if you take the time to check you will see that it is usaully the same group of posters that talk very well of Laser on ET. And you will also see that in their previous posts that they always come to the rescue of laser when some one says something bad about it. And their post usaully sound like a marketing advertisements for it.
udon't know me you're full of shit period. i've used all the platforms you mentioned and laser is as good as any period. i have both laser and anvil and look at yesterday. fuckin anvil was down the whole day and laser worked like a charm. anvil is a very very good platform but no better than laser. sure anvil is fancier and does more things but for raw fills and ease of use laser is very very good. sterling is dog shit and many on here can vouch for that.anvils tech support is arrogant and unfriendly as hell but they know there shit. laser's tech support is very friendly easy to get hold of but many of there reps aren't very sharp.yes serge and the boys are tough to get hold of but frankly i've seen little need to get hold of as the system has been great.as far as api i have no idea but for a manual trader they're good. and there's other good platforms out there like sohnex and lightspeed. but i'd say sterling is the bottom of the barrel.
Other then my issue with "easy to use stops" laser has been fine for me.
tech support not so good but I don't need that much.
Overall i rate it 8 out of 10
light speed is not the same as laser. anyone use lightspeed?
They're both good, but if I had to choose, I'd pick Lightspeed over Laser. It's more stable, even during heavy volume spikes and you don't have to switch servers to get stable price quotes as you do on Laser. Hotkey options are better on LS also. The only drawback on LS is that the charts arent as good as Laser's, but I use Quotetracker for charts so it's irrelevant.
The Title of this thread has been changed since my post. When I first posted on this thread the title was "Opinion on Laser vs. Genesis". Even though "Opinion" is still spelled incorrectly now, it was originally even spelled worse, and was spelled with an "e" in opinion. So I am positive the Title was changed. However we all make spelling and grammatical errors in our own posts. That being said it would probably help to keep this thread productive if you specified what type of trading strategy you trade, such as tape reading or break outs etc.? Also please disclose what about a software and what tools of a software are important to you and rank them on necessity to you and your type of trading? I believe this will benefit you in getting the type of responses that you need to make your decision between platforms.
I have accounts with each CO. Laser has the full book LS only goes 8 deep on the ECN and you can only see the TOP order as far as the market maker.
I have accounts with all three firms and each has their own feature. I just like when one platform has issues i can jump to the other.
I'm sorry to hear about the Linux problems. I started using Genesis for automated (API) trading in the summer of 2004 using Windows on my end. I can say that they are the best and most reliable platform I have ever used. Sure, there have been times when they have had problems, but while not perfect, they are still 10x better than the performance that my friend suffer while doing API trading through Sterling or IB. Granted, you mentioned a Linux issue, which is a OS that I don't use. But for Windows based API trading, I can strongly recommend Genesis.
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