On 10-case geometry and beyond

Discussion in 'Technical Analysis' started by Simples, Jul 3, 2017.

  1. Simples


    From where do you count these bars, not sure which bars or what about them need revisiting?

    I've removed the repeating letters here:


    Is bar 30 19th of Jun? So it's dominant even though on lesser volume?
    #21     Jul 5, 2017
  2. Sprout


    Also revist une 15th
    Making changes will influence other turn ID's.
    Confirm by drawing channels that bound these now emerging defined trends.
    C is your pt1, B is your pt3. If a B repeats adjust your channel pt3.
    Sometimes due to geometry turn A will be the pt3.
    As one zooms into the legs of a bar, it becomes clear why.
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2017
    #22     Jul 5, 2017
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  3. Simples


    I've attempted below and I see you can connect C's with B's, though doesn't seem to make sense always. Is this why you want to remove some B's?

    #23     Jul 5, 2017
  4. Sprout


    Revisit May 19, 24, 29, 30, June 13, 15, 20, 22, etc,..
    When the ID is accurate, clarity follows. A misID has repercussions of confusion. When confusion arises, go back to a "last known good". In other words back to the spot where "you know that you know."

    There are some bars that illustrate "the exception". To point that out now could be confusing. Although, the concepts presented thus far would give you the necessary insight to discern these bars.

    C turn can come at any time. It doesn't change the fact that on the prior bar there could have been a C. However it does change the perception of whether a Dominance shift occurred.

    May 8, Dominance Short presented itself, May 12 is the early perception (from the XO of the rtl short tape FTT - only two bar in length (8,9)).

    May 13 shows Dominance Volume arriving to support the BO from what we now perceive as the non-Dom traverse returning to a larger Dominance context as an increased pace tape (new long traverse) resulting in a VE of the larger channel.

    Tapes build traverses, traverses builds channels, channels can become traverses in larger channels.

    Once you get the correct turn ID's the four trends of turns will reveal themselves.

    This extends and expands our understanding of trends and trendlines.

    Having the "Pattern" image, posted previously on this thread or the one prior in front of you will support this understanding.
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2017
    #24     Jul 5, 2017
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  5. Simples


    Thanks for explanations!

    Going out for a day-trip. I got this far:


    On "The Pattern", what is FRY (right of "DU")?
    Is that failing to manifest in blue traverse above?
    #25     Jul 6, 2017
  6. Simples


    New version, trying to align all this with P and DU:


    Putting on a channel:

    Last edited: Jul 6, 2017
    #26     Jul 6, 2017
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  7. Sprout


    Good work.
    Do the following for increased accuracy.
    ID these turns
    Add May 8, 9, 19
    that doesn't change any ID's
    Add 22, 24, changes 29
    Add June 13, changes 14
    Add 20, changes 21
    Chg 26, Jul1

    You are beginning to use color convention for OOE matching channels - good. By matching the channel color to it's respective pt1, pt2, pt3, etc, will support clarity.

    On any given fractal construction.
    FTT always comes after a pt3. VE's can come after pt3. Once a VE then either another VE (price pushing the LTL out forming a larger fractal container) or an FTT, (in some cases a VE is also an FTT) as price in heading for the RTL. The BO is always the bar with the close and subsequent bar closes crossing over the RTL defined by the pt1 and pt3 (in this fractal container).
    Always start with FFF (faster fractal first).

    As one builds bottom up from two bar comparisons, tapes get built. A series of two bar combinations in a directional movement builds a traverse. A traverse defines the bounds of a forming Channel. Current traverses can expand the bounds of a previous channel. New channels come into view geometrically. Their context submits to the current Price Action and whether RTL's are respected with FBO (new pt3) or their RTL's are crossed over (BO) thereby forming a new channel in the opposite direction. Within a channel, increasing volume can come at any time. If this volume is in harmony with the current directional context then it is a B-turn. If this volume is in opposition with the current directional context then it is a C-turn. Dominance can come at any time. We look to see if this new dominance is Continue (B-turn) or Change (C-turn). The very next bar could be increased volume but again a opposite direction of the previous bar. We are at Change again (C-turn). The next bar could be Incr volume arriving in the opposite direction again. We are at Change again (C-turn). The A and B turn are always in the context of the prior C. If the contexts are not lining up then a Turn ID was missed.

    The operating order of events is a fractal. This fractal gets bound by a larger fractal (traverse) with it's own OOE. This fractal (now traverse) gets bound by a larger fractal (channel). Each have their pt1, pt2, pt3, VE's, FTT's, etc.

    Turns operated within the above context but are limited to the bars where the above it true. Turns give a heads-up that an event has happened. Where that event is in the OOE, gives a heads-up on what to anticipate.

    For either of the two opposing scenarios to unfold, we anticipate seeing the necessary change in volume. Volume is the independent variable, price is the dependent variable.

    Once the turn ID's are accurate, one will be able to trace the movements of price and volume on a bar by bar basis and come to understand three things with greater accuracy.

    What came before?
    What is happening now?
    What must come next?

    The "must" is influenced by one's bias. We are cultivating a neutral bias and receive the market's full dataset by which to make our context determination. We always have two simultaneous narratives. The two "musts" - one reveals it's dominance over the other by observing bar-by-bar both price and volume.

    There are moments where both narratives are true, like the Sym. Drawing contextual lines to define lateral boundaries shows us the moment where price starts to translate again but only if supporting volume arrives else price heads in the opposite direction to create more business by affecting the current market participants perception of value. Volume must increase for a BO. If price BO's of this lateral unsupported by an Incr in Volume, either this volume will arrive on the next series of bars or the BO will fail.

    This method is exact in it's application.

    FRV is first rising volume. It is a term used in the context of Jack Hershey's Position Vector Trading in the archives. In that method he distinguishes and defines dry up and FRV. One can achieve a higher degree of understanding, freedom and facility by applying Jack's perspective of market operation. He describes the Seven Doublings of Capital and what is necessary to achieve it the first time.
    He also introduced SCT, (seamless continuous trading) as a hold and reversal trading concept that could be applied to faster and faster time frames.

    His method for trading multiple streams of equities in a timely manner results in a generously positive equity curve.

    He is a true master. The process by which transference is possible is the process by which you are engaged by actively doing work through MADA.

    We are getting you up to speed by which you can perform MADA with tools that through practice and application will build your mind.

    When I first came across his writings, I didn't understand most of them. I had to explore the threads by Spydertrader. His translation was easier for me to understand. They both have very deep understandings of market structure, operation and how to consistently profit thereby. Both are master teachers in their own standing and have certainly made a world shifting influence on this trader's experience of the markets and how to participate with logic and an informed pov built on self determination.

    Spydertrader's posted charts are an invaluable resource in firmly grounding the concepts we are currently working with. Jack's older material prior to 2012 is the basis for this current work process. Jack's final work is something I'm currently working to achieve a deeper understanding of. It requires a firm grasp of all his prior work, at least in my case.

    Logging is the crux. There are insights derived from bar-to-bar logging that can't be received anywhere else. One can start at any time, sooner than later is best. Logging supports one's focus. Debriefing with the annotated chart and log provides the fastest path for progress.

    This method is also the path least traveled. Even though overgrown, the path is still here where each step taken reveals the next.
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2017
    #27     Jul 6, 2017
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  8. Simples


    Much appreciated! I've tried to ID the bars you mention and also follow the logic in the previous post to ID C, B and A's below. Please note bars from 20 Jun onwards for some sub-bar IDs and also colour-coded Cs and Bs as they seem to be directional:

    Last edited: Jul 6, 2017
    #28     Jul 6, 2017
  9. comagnum


    That chart looks like it was a group project at a mental hospital.
    #29     Jul 6, 2017
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  10. Sprout


    Starting from left to right,
    Bar 5 is a C or B, we do not know in this pane of data. We start with C since it's the first show of dominance. Bar 8 is decr vol but still within the our first channel of the day. This is a non-Dom bar. Bar 9 we have incr vol but it is the opposite of bar 5. This is C turn. This bar also XO the RTL
    Everything is accurate until Bar 22. That is an A-Turn of the C turn on the prior bar 19. Bar 23 has decr vol so we are still in the effect of the A-turn. Bar 24 has incr vol but in the opposite direction as Bar 19's ID of C-turn. It's also the bar that breaks through the lower lateral boundary set at Bar 19. Bar 29 is a continuation of this C-turn on the prior bar. It doesn't get labeled because it's incr Vol just like the bar prior so it's part of the same move.
    Bar 30 and 31 are an exception. Bar 30 doesn't have incr Vol compared to Bar 29 but it does have almost equal. Where have we seen this form before? On the 5x5 grid, the 2 legged bars. 1st and 3rd legs could be missing, 2nd leg always dominant. This (implicit) dominant shift cannot be readily seen by anyone who has not done the 5x5 colored leg drill.
    The confirmation comes at Bar 31. Even though it's decr vol, the price bar has XO the RTL of the larger short channel we just completed. We are seeing the first sign of a BO. June 2nd Bar shows ever so increasing Black volume, same with bar7. Bar 8 is the attempt at the larger short channel to reassert itself with a surge of Red volume. We don't know until bar12.
    Even though it's decr vol, the price increased and XO the most recent tapes RTL. Bar 13 is where everyone sees the BO of the lateral and the VE of the traverse. We don't know what type yet. Bar 14 and 15 see a resurgence of Red Volume, This is the pt 3 of the even larger short channel. This is proven by price following the RTL of this channel until it XO at Jul 1. Price action on this trendline would have moved to the LTL if Red Volume began increasing to the level that we saw in the first week of May. Since no, we know that this Short Channel is ending and a New Long Channel will start. This new long could be another non-Dom traverse.
    We'll know by watching volume.

    Bars June 21 on require reworking to the logic above.

    The notation for the OOE's is different that the notation for the turns. It uses similar logic but focuses on a different aspect.
    Annotating turns involves a granularity of focus. Turns put together do have a sequence. The sequence of turns brings into view the 4 set of turn trends. Turn trends start and stop on C's. The C's would be included.
    C-C is the first.

    What are the others?

    The different colors you are utilizing are creating more clarity for the traverses, good.
    Also, BO's are by convention labelled near the TL and bar where the BO occurred.
    #30     Jul 6, 2017
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