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# On 10-case geometry and beyond

Discussion in 'Technical Analysis' started by Simples, Jul 3, 2017.

1. ### Simples

Ok, I'm happy to share and learn. Coming up with hypothesis and ideas is easy, not so validating them generally.

Here's my next attempt, hoping I get the colour right (from volume bar, close-open?):

Yes, you can't program anything unless you know what to program, so first you need to program your mind.

Not sure what to find before and after two-bar combos. If it is XB/XR, there's usually some peak or trough associated with it. Maybe easier to read with these lines and should they be adjusted according to volume somehow?

#11     Jul 4, 2017
2. ### Sprout

• ###### trend segments - nD-D - debrief.jpg
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1.3 MB
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#12     Jul 4, 2017
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3. ### Simples

I've put on laterals here without the yellow (NB. 7th Jun seems not to be inside bar):

For below chart:

Thanks for the correction. I believe I'm confused exactly what is meant by "long" and "short" in the text below, and how to interpret Non-Dominant Traverse bar for bar. Where/how to look to discern which direction is Non-Dominant (aka anti-Dominance), bar for bar, with certainty in order to draw Non-Dominant Traverse objectively? Can bar #2 in relation with bar #1, ie. using 10-case model be used, except for SYM, Hitch and OB?

Inverted D/nD analysis 20-21 Jun below (dominant traverse is short), is this correct?
Is it correct that colour of Dominant Traversal always be black when long, and red when short?

Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
#13     Jul 4, 2017
4. ### Sprout

Comment with quote.

You've got it. So in any two bar comparison, let's use XR and XB - these two bars define a directional 2 bar trend. We connect the extremes of these two bar points. This is the Dominant Price direction. The smaller traverse of this 2 bar trend is the non-Dominant Price direction.

As you can see, multi-bar sequences form a trend segment. A trend segment connects larger trends. For example from the 9 to the 17 would be a either one trade on the larger fractal or 3 trades on the faster fractals of three trend segments. PA traders use large stops to accommodate this operation of the market.

Every trend regardless of fractal size from intra-bar legs to multi-day bars is defined by three moves.

Just before the first move of the current trend is the 3rd move of the prior trend. Since trends interlock and oscillate. This might not be seen right away. It's ok. We look for Dominance.

We are always on the lookout for Dominance.
We know that what comes before is non-Dominance.

Now with the Laterals, notice when the laterals end with a BO as well as the price form for the FBO of the lateral boundaries. We are focusing on the close of bar now. The close can either happen within a pre-defined and annotated lateral boundary, on the line, or crosses over the line.

Each gives us an indication of what must next, dependent of what volume is presenting.

A Lateral comes into existence when the H's and L's of Bar.0 AND Bar.1 is within or equal to the H and L of Bar.2
This is the third bar of the lateral. Each successive bar gets a label of it's bar count. For example the next bar on the example above is 4, then 5, 6,7, etc.

The BO of the lateral occurs on the bar that closes outside the lateral boundary. However this break could and frequently fails. When two successive bars close outside the lateral boundary, the lateral has served it's purpose.

Laterals can contain laterals.

The zigzag exercise is not an annotation one would do for trading. It's more to create a mental space and image in one's mind of where the greatest and lowest risk profit making opportunities exist.

It also leads us to start looking at volume to distinguish Dominance in real time.

#14     Jul 4, 2017
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5. ### Simples

Ah, I see. Yes, Laterals / SYM are non-dominant moves, so mark as "breathers" between dominance.

Completing and fixing up chart below:

#15     Jul 4, 2017
6. ### Sprout

Thank you for correcting and filling in the chart.

Now we are focusing in on the turns. We can know we have a turn by three visual cues.

One is geometrically easy to identify such a a single bar spike and change of direction.

Another is in the grid of 5x5 where as one builds each bar by following the legs in the mind's eye where a Dominant shift occurred by the sequence of legs, leg direction and/or absence of 1st/3rd leg.

The third has more to do with space than form. The space being an FTT within the parallelogram.

Each will signal at different moments as a bar is built or by the resulting form (and comparison) of the bar thereafter.

First let's define an A turn. This is one where the Dominance is shifting to non-Dominance. B turn is the shift from non-Dom to Dom. C turn is where the previous Dominance is no longer and the Dominance has shifted into a new dominant direction.
Dominance to Dominance.
Rapid change of sentiment.

How we know this is that we have Increasing Volume. Whenever there is increasing volume we have Dominance.

How we contextualize it makes all the difference.

To see this clearer, we have to intentionally make a mistake.
With all the increasing volume bars, annotate the associate price bar with an arrow and the text
C
D-D.

This is a Dominant Turn. Not all these turns will be C turns, some will be B turns.
Which ones?
Why?

Last edited: Jul 5, 2017
#16     Jul 5, 2017
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7. ### Simples

So is every increasing volume bar either a B or C-turn?

I'm guessing B are bars that are more "choppy" in relation to previous bar, rather than a clean turn.
Ie. 16 Mar below is more of a continuation after a lower fractal flag (faster "chop") on 15 Mar was broken the day after.

You can get an idea by following price movement from previous bar to the current bar and see how the two bars relate regarding chop -> movement or movement -> reverse-movement

Though it would be good to have clear guidelines what is what, ie. in relation with 5x5 grid and/or 10-cases, which should be doable (but need more clarity on this concept first).

I need to do this annotation simple like so (with C-mistakes):

Last edited: Jul 5, 2017
#17     Jul 5, 2017
8. ### Sprout

The turn that comes after the C turn is the

A
D-nD

It's always has decr Volume.

Then the turn that is a return to Dominance which has incr V. (If it's still in the trend started by the C before the A.)

B
nD-D
(You'll have to relabel some of the C's.)

It's useful to have the text descriptor below the turn ID. That's why to use a line or arrow for spacing.

If you do this on the previous zigzag chart, some things will start to become clearer(although messy).

#18     Jul 5, 2017
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9. ### Simples

Ok, let me see if I got the sequence right.
• A D-nD is always on decreasing volume
• B nD-D comes after A, always on increasing volume
• C D-D comes after B or C, always on increasing volume

Ignoring the first 2 bars since 1st bar volume delta is unknown, can this categorization below be correct?

If so, it seems A marks non-DOM periods, B marks start of return to dominance and C marks dominance. You can then easily identify the volume sequence in relationship with price-chart and annotations. I've colour-coded this above to make it even easier to read.

#19     Jul 5, 2017
10. ### Sprout

Bars 19, 24, 30, 13, 15, 20, 26
Require revisiting for correct ID.

Once you have turn ID, it's like a price lateral - it defines the following bar's until change. In other words drop any repeating letters after it first makes it's presence known.

30 is a special case, an exception to the rule. We get insight on this via the 2-legged bar on our 5x5. Unseen dominance within the shadow of the prior bar.

C can arrive at any time. It is change. Whether that change lasts a bar or several it matters not. We now know a signal of change via the work done to build the mind.
There is more for we are working to build a system based on a complete dataset.

Distinguishing this one adds another block in our foundation of understanding the market's system of operation.

Last edited: Jul 5, 2017
#20     Jul 5, 2017
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