"Old School" trader needs some 2007 info and help

Discussion in 'Prop Firms' started by Old School, Nov 16, 2006.

  1. Greetings fellow traders,

    Allow me to introduce myself and please forgive me for the long first post.

    I started trading in 1989 and stopped trading in 2002 (after 9/11). I was one of the original daytrading dirty dozen at Worldco when the world was a different place. I ran groups at Worldco and started my own LLC through other clearing firms (I left Worldco when the I smelled the smoke). I was one of those that traded 1-2 million shares/day back in the "days".

    Now, in my 40's, I am looking to get back into the business in a quiet way and have some questions. I have not kept up with all the industry changes since I left and I could use some help. I've read through the forums and found some of the answers but not all, so please excuse me if I ask a question that might have already been answered somewhere in these threads.

    Thanks in advance for any help...


    1- What is the current status of prop trading?

    I've read here and elsewhere that the days of prop trading might be over from a regulatory perspective. Most firms are closed - except a few being discussed here. Is the business still a shade of grey or is there a firm out there that's meeting all requirements of the reg agencies? I only see a few still being mentioned; Bright, Assent, Echo, Trinix etc...are these firms fully "compliant"? Whatever that means in 2007?

    2- Have there been any HUGE changes in the mkt to affect trading?

    When I was around, NX, ECN's, Bullets, MOC imbalances, Index change trades, etc... All these and more were some of the buzz words/strategies of our time. I guess what I'm asking is, are there 2007 counterparts to these that have made a big change in the way daytraders trade? I'm not looking for setups, rather, just curious if anything new in the mkt has made traders adjust in a major way.

    3- Are the "deals" similar as it was around the year 2001?

    High payouts, comm's based on vol, free datafeeds, etc?

    4- Are licenses still required (7,55,63) or are there firms who do not require licensing?

    5- What kind of leverage is granted these days on $15-$25k accounts? Intraday and overnight.

    6- FINALLY, are there any "old school" traders who run groups/firms that might have an interest in a trader like myself? Please feel free to respond here or through the PM's.

    Wow, I didn't realize how long this post became. My apologies.


    "Old School"
  2. If[question=not_answered]&[time>21:30:00EST],[sellshort 1,000,000,000 ET@MKT] :D
  3. gov


    I am not going to be of any help, since I have gone my own way and trade mostly futures and derivatives (tax advantages) but I just wanted to thank you for making me think of those things again. And something you didn't mention...trading in 1/8's and quarters! Ahhhh, the good old days. Level II actually was worth something. Bullets, weren't those a hoot! License to kill....er, I mean short!

    Good luck getting back, markets are the markets so you'll do fine I bet.
  4. 1 - Not worried about those first 3 names.

    2 - Bullets are gone. People use conversions and slips, etc. Additionally, getting short is now as easy as getting long in certain stocks due to what you'll read at the link below. Basically, a large group of stocks has essentially become short-exempt.

    NYSE has begun to go "Hybrid"; something 1/2 way between what you remember as Nasdaq and NYSE. Plenty of details at NYSE web site under Hybrid.

    Read this:


    The above from SEC site is ongoing.

    3 - Rates have come down some, but yes. Same variables.

    4 - Depends where you go. Generally, yes.

    5 - Works the same way it did then.

    6 - Check your PM box.

  5. Thanks to those who replied..whether you helped or not. :cool:

    I got a few PM's so thanks to those senders also.

    A couple of you asked for my name and I answered if I recognized yours or a mutual friend's name.

    "You're going to make a million dollars!"

    What W.B. said to me circa 1996 - at the interview! ROFLMAO!
  6. lescor


    I think you'd do fine with your experience. One big change from back in the day is the ranges on stocks. There is just nowhere near the volatility you saw back then. The other is that commissions are much lower. The result is that lots of guys trade more size with less cost and still do well. Reading the specialist is WAY harder. All kinds of automation and algorithmic trading, big orders broken up into many small orders. Everyone's good at not showing their hand. The ecn's make up a huge part of listed trading now too. And with hybrid being rolled out, nyse is going to look a whole lot more like nasdaq.

    But trading is still trading. I'm sure it'd take some time to get the mojo back, but I wouldn't bet against someone with your experience.

    Good luck,
  7. Well said.
  8. ...horseshit futures, if there is volatility and liquidity. 2007 will be no different than 1997, just like 1997 was no different than 1987.
  9. Sorry but I have to ask...

    For someone who was trading millions of shares and I assume making big change, why are you looking for $15k accounts or searching for a firm that would hire you?

    Did things go that sour that fast?

  10. Yes, things got VERY bad in many ways for me around 9/11/01.

    Personal and financial.

    I see why you would want to ask though. If you help me make some of my change back, perhaps over a cold one I could share with you one day....:D

    Jokes aside, I'm literally starting over and just wanted to see what the business is like in 2007 for small accounts.
    #10     Nov 16, 2006