ElatedMaverick, Why do you rule out the possibility that a "go-along" was NOT on the offer, and that the interest seen on the offer was NOT the go-along? How would you interpret the following sections of the rule:
Rockford, once again, the partial rule that you just posted in your response to EM gives the priority to the bid or offer as entitled to it under paragraph (a) based on time, which you conveniently omitted again. That, and all of the evidence presented numerous times on this thread as well as the opinion of the person whom you appointed as the expert, and others, indicate that a floor broker CANNOT step in front of and size out the specialist book, as you claim was the case with Dan's order. I don't want to repeat it all again here, but I believe that this point has been well established. If you can kindly post specifically what it is about this that you do not understand or have issue with perhaps myself or someone else can present it in more simple or specific terms. To the moderator: I am hopeful that under your watchful eyes this thread can remain civil, and any attempts to point out misinformation and offer more correct answers will not be met with further accusations of it being harassement. I myself will do my part and resolve to make a conscious effort to keep all of my own postings on topic and if they should stray away, I welcome the notice if it being so. Thank You.
As soon as one of them can tell me the name of just 3 listed companies form the date the NYSE opened, I will respond to their arguements!!!! They can not because there is only ONE still trading today and it will not trade forever and will eventually go under. Which means that wealth is NOT created but merely transfered from player to player. The arguement of dividends is a stupid one because the common phrase that is being discussed here is " TRADING is a zero sum game".
This is Dan's exact description of what happened to his order. He immediately received an insulting response, and then understandably did not continue his participation in the thread. It has been claimed that Dan had time priority under paragraph I.(a) of NYSE Rule 72, which covers priority of bids, and which is made applicable to offers by paragraph II. A fact proving that Dan did not have time priority, under paragraph I.(a), is that the paragraph provides that in the event of a partial fill, which Dan did receive, the remaining unfilled balance of his offer immediately lost any time priority under paragraph I.(a). Paragraph I.(a) is very clear that the time priority it provides is only good for the first partial fill. It does not continue after the first partial fill. So this solidly proves that paragraph I.(a) did not give Dan time priority. It is, of course, true that Dan always had time priority over any other orders in the specialist book. But this is not the issue. The issue is whether the specialist, in representing Dan's order, had time priority over all other floor brokers, who were not in the book, and the clear answer is no, he did not have time priority over floor brokers after his partial fill. Floor broker bids and offers are generally not part of the specialist book. If any other NYSE trade executed at Dan's price, prior to the first partial fill he did receive, then this would also prevent Dan from receiving time priority even on his first partial fill. This is because paragraph I.(a) applies only to the first offer to establish a new price level. Any subsequent offers at that price level are governed by rules other than time priority. Professor Blume says: And our former specialist, cstu, expressed almost complete agreement with Professor Blume.
Professor Blume wrote: I believe the former specialist, cstu, expressed general agreement with Professor Blume, but let's hope he will eventually come back and clarify whether his agreement includes this particular point. I hope we can all agree, at this point, that price-time priority governs only priority within the specialist's order book, and that it does not govern the relationship between the specialist book and the floor brokers.
Rockford, I'm afraid you are missing the whole point yet again. I will do my best to explain and break it down into simpler terms for you so that you can understand where you are wrong. We are clear that Dan's order was the first on the book at his price, and he does get a partial fill. As he states, a 200k order later shows up there. After that point, Dan see several bids appear on the tape at his price, and 40k shares trade at his price in total of which he gets filled on none. This proves that the 200k was NOT on parity with Dan's order. CTSU, whom you have already attributed as being someone who know's things and an expert, has already confirmed this and in fact corrected you on this issue. Once again, here is that quote where he first quotes your incorrect statement and then goes on to correct it: What ctsu, who you keep saying agreed with you, was actually saying here, is that there is no way that another order could have jumped ahead of the specialist book, but the best it could do was match. Since Dan did not participate in any further fill this was clearly not the case. It is plain as day and I'm not sure how to make it any more clearer to you, but if you need me to I will try. I hope others can join in here as well, and there were a few who I believe who also were in agreement. The Prof. Blume comment which you keep citing is irrelevant to this, and in fact when you say that ctsu agreed with Prof Blume you are incorrect. What he actually said was that it was "pretty good and telling". Most importantly however, that comment was made prior the much more relevant comment which I quoted above where he in facts corrects your misinformation and lays this matter to rest. I've done my best to break this down and make it clear for you over these past 20 pages Rockford, but if you need more explanation or breaking down I will be happy to oblige. My goal is that you understand this and that there is no further confusion which would be a disservice to the thread.
I have always expressed the opinion that the 200K of selling interest, or any other sell orders arriving after Dan's order, did not have parity with Dan, and that Dan had priority over those sell orders. I have always expressed the opinion that the specialist book is strictly price-time priority, so that Dan had priority over the 200k. I expressed the opinion that the selling interest which executed with priority ahead of Dan, or executed with Dan at parity, was NOT the 200K which he saw on the specialist book. I have suggested that perhaps the trades reported after his partial fill were reported later in time, but may have resulted from selling interest on parity with Dan's partial fill. Hamlet, You once again inaccurately described my statements. Please kindly stop presenting what you think I said. Please kindly allow me to speak for myself. The topic of the thread is "Observations on the NYSE specialist." The topic of the thread is not "Proof that jimrockford said something wrong about the NYSE specialist." The topic is not "let's make jimrockford understand something." Please confine your dicussion to talking about the NYSE, and please do not talk about me. Thank you for your kind attention to this matter.
These scenarios which have been proposed are not consistent with what took place or with anything ctsu said could have occured, since as ctsu said, a floor broker cannot step in front of the book, take over, and cause Dan to stop getting executed. I described the reasons in the post above why these scenarios are wrong.
Perhaps market sell orders, or offers priced one cent or more below Dan's limit price, arrived and therefore had price priority over Dan, and that any such limit orders were executed before they could be displayed? Perhaps they received price improvement, so that they executed at Dan's limit price? This would be consistent with what cstu said, that long sells do not get priority over short sells. And it would confirm my opinion that the 200K shares of selling interest, which Dan saw on the book, had nothing to do with the execution. Anybody?