Obama major liar about healthcare

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by maxpi, Aug 25, 2009.

  1. maxpi


    An Urgent Message From the League of American Voters

    Dear Friend:

    Are Obama and his friends taking you as a fool?

    You have to wonder what they really think about the intelligence of the American people.

    Obama repeatedly has out-and-out lied about his healthcare plan.

    Here are just 5 of the big whoppers.

    Lie #1: 'You Keep Your Doctor, You Keep Your Insurer'

    This is a complete fabrication.

    Under plans Obama has backed in the House and the Senate, almost any business can opt their employees into the "public option" — the government health plan.

    That means you could lose your insurer. And if your doctor is worth his salt, you'll lose him or her as well.

    Why? Because great doctors probably will not want to get the very low rates the government will pay private doctors who are part of the new government system.

    So, without your consent, you very easily could lose your insurer and your doctor.

    Lie #2: The Elderly Will Not Face Rationing or Medicare Cuts

    More baloney.

    In fact, just last week, The New York Times, a very liberal and very pro-Obama newspaper, admitted that fears of rationing for elderly patients are "not irrational."

    The truth is that Obamacare would add almost 50 million new patients to government care.

    Who would pay for it. You would!

    Seniors on Medicare will be the first hit.

    Here's what the Times reported: "Bills now in Congress would squeeze savings out of Medicare, a lifeline for the elderly, on the assumption that doctors and hospitals can be more efficient."

    This means that faceless bureaucrats will decide the type and quality of your care.

    It is a very dangerous thing to give your life and well-being over to government bureaucrats!

    Imagine if you or a loved one is older than 80 years and critically needs heart surgery.

    Instead of getting the heart procedure, you or that loved one could be informed that you are simply too old.

    We at the League of American Voters have been warning of this danger and have a powerful TV commercial exposing the risks to seniors.

    You can see the ad by Going Here Now

    Lie #3: There Will Be No "Death Panels."

    More lies.

    Sure, they don't call them "death panels" in the legislation, but that's what their job will be.

    These committee members will set guidelines with which faceless bureaucrats will make decisions about you and your healthcare.

    They will decide who lives and who dies. They decide who gets critical procedures and expensive medicines.

    Again, according to the New York Times, the Democratic plans call for saving money by creating new oversight committees.

    The Times says that Medicare and insurers would be expected to follow "advice from a new federal panel of medical experts on 'what treatments work best.'”

    Again, this very liberal paper concluded: "The zeal for cutting health costs, combined with proposals to compare the effectiveness of various treatments and to counsel seniors on end-of-life care, may explain why some people think the legislation is about rationing, which could affect access to the most expensive services in the final months of life."

    Expose the lies — Go Here Now.

    Lie #4: The Obama Plan Contains Costs

    Absolute nonsense.

    The Obama plan will cost more than $1 trillion in new federal outlays, according to the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office.

    This past weekend, Sen. Joe Lieberman claimed that most of this cost comes from adding 50 million people, currently uninsured, to the government health system.

    But as Lieberman pointed out, we just don't have the money to do this right now.

    You can add only so many people to the government system by cutting medical care to seniors on Medicare and raising taxes.

    Democrats clearly plan to do both.

    Lie #5: Illegals Are Not Covered by Obamacare

    President Obama has stated time and again that illegal aliens are not covered under his new plan.

    Still, Democrats say they want to add almost 50 million uninsured. Yet almost one-quarter of these uninsured are illegal aliens.

    None of the Democratic plans excludes illegal aliens.

    In fact, when Republicans proposed an amendment to the House plan to block illegals from getting free government healthcare, Speaker Nancy Pelosi and her minions soundly defeated the motion.

    Many, many lies are emanating from Washington today.
  2. Lucrum


  3. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_fact_check_health_poll

    Print Back to story

    FACT CHECK: Health overhaul myths taking root

    By CALVIN WOODWARD, Associated Press Writer Calvin Woodward, Associated Press Writer
    Wed Aug 19, 9:43 pm ET

    WASHINGTON – The judgment is harsh in a new poll that finds Americans worried about the government taking over health insurance, cutting off treatment to the elderly and giving coverage to illegal immigrants. Harsh, but not based on facts.

    President Barack Obama's lack of a detailed plan for overhauling health care is letting critics fill in the blanks in the public's mind. In reality, Washington is not working on "death panels" or nationalization of health care.

    To be sure, presenting Congress and the country with the nuts and bolts of a revamped system of health insurance is no guarantee of success for a president — just ask Bill and Hillary Rodham Clinton. Their famous flop was demonized, too. After all, the devil does lurk in details.

    It can also lurk in generalities, it seems.

    Obama is promoting his changes in something of a vacuum, laying out principles, goals and broad avenues, some of which he's open to amending. As lawmakers sweat the nitty gritty, he's doing a lot of listening, and he's getting an earful.

    A new NBC News poll suggests some of the myths and partial truths about the plans under consideration are taking hold.

    Most respondents said the effort is likely to lead to a "government takeover of the health care system" and to public insurance for illegal immigrants. Half said it will probably result in taxpayers paying for abortions and nearly that many expected the government will end up with the power to decide when treatment should stop for old people.

    A look at each of those points:

    THE POLL: 45 percent said it's likely the government will decide when to stop care for the elderly; 50 percent said it's not likely.

    THE FACTS: Nothing being debated in Washington would give the government such authority. Critics have twisted a provision in a House bill that would direct Medicare to pay for counseling sessions about end-of-life care, living wills, hospices and the like if a patient wants such consultations with a doctor. They have said, incorrectly, that the elderly would be required to have these sessions.

    House Republican Leader John Boehner of Ohio said such counseling "may start us down a treacherous path toward government-encouraged euthanasia."

    The bill would prohibit coverage of counseling that presents suicide or assisted suicide as an option.

    Republican Sen. Johnny Isakson of Georgia, who has been a proponent of coverage for end-of-life counseling under Medicare, said such sessions are a voluntary benefit, strictly between doctor and patient, and it was "nuts" to think death panels are looming or euthanasia is part of the equation.

    But as fellow conservatives stepped up criticism of the provision, he backed away from his defense of it.


    THE POLL: 55 percent expect the overhaul will give coverage to illegal immigrants; 34 percent don't.

    THE FACTS: The proposals being negotiated do not provide coverage for illegal immigrants.


    THE POLL: 54 percent said the overhaul will lead to a government takeover of health care; 39 percent disagree.

    THE FACTS: Obama is not proposing a single-payer system in which the government covers everyone, like in Canada or some European countries. He says that direction is not right for the U.S. The proposals being negotiated do not go there.

    At issue is a proposed "exchange" or "marketplace" in which a new government plan would be one option for people who aren't covered at work or whose job coverage is too expensive. The exchange would offer some private plans as well as the public one, all of them required to offer certain basic benefits.

    That's a long way from a government takeover. But when Obama tells people they can just continue with the plans they have now if they are happy with them, that can't be taken at face value, either. Tax provisions could end up making it cheaper for some employers to pay a fee to end their health coverage, nudging some patients into a public plan with different doctors and benefits. Over time, critics fear, the public plan could squeeze private insurers out of business because they would not be able to compete with the federal government.

    It's unclear now whether Obama is committed to the public option. He described it recently as "just one sliver" of health reform, suggesting it was expendable if lawmakers could agree on another way to expand affordable coverage. Now the White House is emphasizing his strong support for it.


    THE POLL: 50 percent expect taxpayer dollars will be used to pay for abortions; 37 percent don't.

    THE FACTS: The House version of legislation would allow coverage for abortion in the public plan. But the procedure would be paid for with dollars from beneficiary premiums, not from federal funds. Likewise, private plans in the new insurance exchange could opt to cover abortion, but no federal subsidies would be used to pay for the procedure.

    Opponents say the prohibition on federal money for the procedure is merely a bookkeeping trick and what matters is that Washington would allow abortion to be covered under government-subsidized insurance.

    Obama has stated that the U.S. should continue its tradition of "not financing abortions as part of government-funded health care." Current laws prohibiting public financing of abortion would stay on the books.

    Yet abortion guidelines are not yet clear for the government-supervised insurance exchange. There is strong sentiment in Congress on both sides of the issue.


    The poll of 805 people was taken Aug. 15-17 and has a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 3.5 percentage points.
  4. I would also suggest checking sites like fact check and politfact before listening to the bullshit maxipad has posted
  5. All this author is doing is comparing what the analysis and critics say compared to what Obama says. he does not take into account that Obama is a liar.
    Obama can say the Public option will just compete against the private insurance. The Government does not need to worry about raising capitol or having to make a profit for its shareholders. Government run programs do not need to consider catastrophic risks to its business. Government at the same time will regulate and make the rules for private business......Would you buy stock in a private company operating in this environment.
  6. Lucrum


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    The guy is a major liar.

    Barack Obama "I happen to be a proponent of of a single payer universal healthcare plan."

    Barack Obama "I have not said I was a single payer supporter"

    Its a major contradiction and if Obama is lying about this what else is he lying about.
  8. His points were accurate. The AP article was an exercise in obfuscation, just a reprint of Obama talking/lying points.

    For example, if illegals are not covered, why defeat an amendment making that clear? Obviously because they will be covered, no matter what obama is saying now.
  9. http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...e-health-care-illegal-immigrants-health-bill/

    The Truth-O-Meter Says:

    "All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free health care services."
    Chain e-mail on Tuesday, July 28th, 2009 in a chain e-mail

    No free health care for illegal immigrants in the health bill

    It may be the longest chain e-mail we've ever received. A page-by-page analysis of the House health care bill argues that reform will end the health care system as we know it: "Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed! ... Page 42: The 'Health Choices Commissioner' will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. ... Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free health care services."

    Most of the e-mail's claims are wrong, and you can read our extended analysis to find out why.

    One of its most bizarre claims is the one about free health care for noncitizens, "illegal or not."

    We read the bill and its legislative summary, and could find nothing about free health care for anyone, much less noncitizens.

    To confirm our examination, we turned to Jennifer Tolbert, an independent health care analyst at the Kaiser Family Foundation, a nonpartisan foundation that studies health care reform. Tolbert has read and analyzed all the major health proposals, including those of the Republicans, and the foundation provides point-by-point analyses of the plans on its Web site.

    "No one's provided with free health care. That's ridiculous," she said.

    Page 50, which the e-mail references, is part of Section 152, which includes a generic nondiscrimination clause saying that insurers may not discriminate with regard to "personal characteristics extraneous to the provision of high quality health care or related services."

    The section says nothing about "non-US citizens" or immigrants, legal or otherwise. In fact, the legislation specifically states that "undocumented aliens" will not be eligible for credits to help them buy health insurance, in Section 246 on page 143.

    The bottom line here is the e-mail is making things up. The bill does not say anything close to "All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free health care services." We rate this chain e-mail statement Pants on Fire!
  10. Lucrum



    "In 2008, federal Medicaid and Medicare spending totaled $676 billion. Comprising only 2 percent of the federal budget in 1967, these two programs today consume 23 percent of total federal spending. This is the largest component of the federal budget, even exceeding total wartime outlays for national defense."

    "Corrected for inflation, Medicare and Medicaid spending has increased by 2,735 percent since funding began in 1967. That is a real annual growth rate of 8.5 percent, almost three times the annual rate of economic growth for the same period!"

    "So while private citizens pay the lion's share of taxes to fund Medicare and Medicaid, we are also cross-subsidizing these government programs through higher insurance premiums than we would otherwise pay. This is a primary reason medical care has become more expensive. "

    "We hear constantly about the "47 million uninsured." These figures include 10 to 25 million illegal immigrants, 14 million people who are already eligible for medical benefits but haven't availed themselves, and 10 million people earning $75,000 or more who could presumably afford their own insurance if they chose to. Even assuming the lowest estimate for illegal immigrants, the true number of uninsured would be only 13 million. Yet the Democrats want to nationalize the entire industry, currently 17 percent of GDP, to provide benefits to 4 percent of the U.S. population."
    #10     Aug 25, 2009