New To Trading...

Discussion in 'Trading' started by ktmexc20, Dec 4, 2003.

  1. Turok

    Turok

    >pessimism and sarcasm have no beneficial value.

    Realism and honesty rock however.

    There is no lasting pessimism in observing and voicing an opinion that you are not ready to trade using the methods you describe. There would be pessimism in saying that you are not capable of becoming what you wish and I have heard no one do that.

    >There something called tact. In relation to some your
    >responses, you might consider to employ it

    Ok, here is some realism and honesty as tactful as possible.

    Your personality and capabilities may well be perfectly suited to trading. You seem like just a super great person and I wish you the best. So far however you have displayed or entertained the following:

    1: a desire, yea a stated *need* to be successful right from the start. (you say it’s a poor choice of words…I say it’s a *bad strategy*)

    2: a demonstrated lack of general trading knowledge by your claim that will you act only on “assured statistical probability”. First, you are not a card counter in Vegas and there is no such thing as assured in the markets. Second, as others have pointed out so well, you don’t yet know how you are going to act when things get strange. Third, being a person who wants to trade on the shorter terms (flat every night) statistical analysis at it’s very market best becomes less and less important compared to your knowledge of order flow and the reactions of MMs and Specialists who greatly drive short term movement. (Bottom line, your plan to act only on assured statistical probability…not only a bad, but an impossible strategy)

    2 or 2a, take your pick.

    2: Through your initial statement that you can judge an “on target” entry by whether an entry price stop is taken out, you demonstrate a lack of basic knowledge of price movement. (bad strategy)

    2a: By accepting a stop method so poor that you (a rank beginner) would never have even considered it except to appease a friend (your words), you show a desire to please others in the face of overwhelming evidence (even worse strategy)

    4: deluded yourself into awarding self multiple “smart money” tags when logically only the market can give out such awards. (bad strategy)

    On the plus side:

    1: You claim to have studied for some time and that shows a wisdom beyond a desire for easy money.
    2: You have demonstrated restraint – a much missing trait among early trading wanabees.
    3: You are in the best online forum around and asking questions.

    So, my last “friendly comment/advice” to you is to listen to the many friendly comments and advice that have been given you and stop being so darn sensitive about any tone you perceive. I’d be surprised if there is a single contributor to this thread that doesn’t wish you to succeed to everything you dream.

    And by the way… I am not one of the Elite traders after which this web site is name, though like you I aspire.

    JB
     
    #41     Dec 5, 2003
  2. gms

    gms

    No, "cynicism" is not constructive criticism . It's a whole 'nother word with a whole 'nother meaning. It's already too bad 99.9% of the population thinks a "lecturn" is a "podium". Let's keep definitions out of the realm of personal feelings! "Cynicism" means to deny the sincerity of people's motives and acts. It comes out of an ancient Greek school of philosophy, the Cynics, who taught that only virtue was good; to achieve it one must stay apart from the world and its pleasures; therefore, they became critical of society and its material interests. They didn't supply constructive criticism at all. :D

    In my reading through these forums, my opinion is that lindq is tough, but honest.

    There's really not much more advice a new trader can get than what has been posted throughout ET and in your local library. Experience will teach you the rest of the things you need that are heretofore unknown.
     
    #42     Dec 5, 2003
  3. Please believe that I appreciate and respect every response that's been given(setting aside the sarcasm). It's not totally possible to know all now, that will be learned going forward. As It's not totally possible for someone to gauge how well prepared I am, and how well I am going to preform come time.

    I am going to post my picks for Monday (Sunday night), and results after the close. I truly am respectful for the input you've given me, as well as, the markets. My ambition is to be apart of the 10%,or so, who do make it.
     
    #43     Dec 5, 2003
  4. Mecro

    Mecro


    You know, you would be far better off just forgetting everything you learned for two years and just simply start out fresh.

    It sounds like a lot of what you learned is only going to hinder and frustrate you. That's the impression I get from your posts.

    I doubt you're gonna do that but you'll probably understand why in a few months.
     
    #44     Dec 5, 2003
  5. Why not start your equities trading career with some quarter term positions before you attempt day trading which statistically is the purest form of gambling?

    You say you rely on statistics yet your (passion, avarice) emotions, or goals have led you to day trading? This doesn't seem prudent but illogical.

    You do seem timid for not having bought any shares before in your life (and having studied for two years).

    I don't know much about you, you seem bright so why have you decided to invest your money the riskiest way. If you really wan to learn to day trade it seems to me that the best way to learn would be to get a job as a runner.

    Emotional intelligence cannot be taught and statistically you will probably lose. You have enough information to be a good long position trader, why blow it?

    And to lose after spending two years preparing would be even more devastating than usual. I suppose you will use stops but pick a few bad ones in a row and down you go. It is true that it is difficult to emotionally recover from great losses. When I was eighteen I made about 150% in two months and then bought 80,000 worth of stock on a free riding mission. I lost my money in three days and it took me seven years until this year to come back to trading.

    Surely my example is extreme and someone such as yourself will not make such rash decisions but everyone has flaws, what is yours? And if you know, can you correct it?

    Blah blah blah. Sorry for the preaching but I hope you can come to your senses about the day trading idea. All you need to do to become parvenu is achieve a capitalization rate of 50% per year and live frugally until you hit your goal.

    If only I can listen to my own holy wisdom.
     
    #45     Dec 6, 2003
  6. nkhoi

    nkhoi Moderator

    the name is master stroke, imagine if he name it the Dow Trader, I doubt if it even reach 30 members.
     
    #46     Dec 6, 2003
  7. Setting limits - a big thing in life. How do we receive the advise of others? I have always been somewhat impressionable, letting others influence me in many ways. So, if I venture to ask a question, I have definitely placed myself or my ego or my welfare in a vulnerable position. To avoid the downside of asking questions, I need to have some way of filtering constructive/ useful replies from the other type.

    What bothered me in reading your post was the type of stop loss you are considering. So, bothered enough to think, I realized that when we place a trade, we are actually asking a question of the market - it is a trend question in some variety of time frame. (Until now I was thinking of having an opinion on the market as leading to the trade.) But the trade itself is a question. And I need to place stops at that point where the question is answered, "NO!", the trend is the other way." But before I do this, I need to know how much I am going to be charged for that question. 1 point, 2 points, 10 points? What fee can I afford for asking this question. So this is part of the money management process of setting a stop loss, ie, can I afford a stop loss of 10 points.... just choosing 1 point below entry is pretty random, don't you think? Consider setting the stop at the price where the market would be telling you that the reason for the trade is no longer valid. You have no idea how much money you can lose by getting whipsawed! If you cannot afford more than a 1 point stop loss, you need more capital. If you don't have ideas about how to evaluate the market's replies to your questions (trades), you need to study the language some more.

    Finally, stops employed on longer time frames are wider than those typically used on shorter time frames. Doesn't that pose an interesting question? Why would we think that a 1 point stop on a 5 minute chart is "truth" when on a 60 minute or on a daily, a reasonable stop would be far wider? New traders like the idea of daytrading because the stop losses are tighter, but the risk is actually increased if you are not aware of a broader picture offered by the next time frame up... and the larger stop loss implied.
     
    #47     Dec 21, 2003
  8. traderob

    traderob

    This is a good (old) thread with great advice to a newbie, wonder how he is doing..
     
    #48     Feb 22, 2004
  9. He has been telling us.
     
    #49     Feb 22, 2004
  10. sjp

    sjp

    Sir, I look forward to being on the other side of your trades.

    Best of luck to you
    Yours
    Anticipatory Trader
     
    #50     Feb 25, 2004