New SEC rule has me crying...

Discussion in 'Trading' started by ronniejack, Aug 14, 2001.

  1. Hitman


    When you say calculation do you mean support resistance points, or do you mean specific numbers on the futures that would trigger program buy/sell? I am familiar with both concepts.

    I trade stuff that moves with futures, if you can toss me a bone I will really appreciate it. I didn't know this is some sort of black box material, if this is some top secret discovery then never mind.

    I am sure everyone would love to find that one indicator that leads futures. So if you can give me a hint please do so. Nothing is a lock . . .

    I know a few futures traders at my firm. I am going to post it on my journal when I do find it. I thought there had to be something else that futures traders watch.

    Gotta go digging tommorrow.

    #21     Aug 14, 2001
  2. Wow! Thank you all for the valuable insight. I really appreciate everyone offering so many suggestions -- I have a lot to consider. I do want to continue trading stocks vs. futures and options at this point, and it sounds like there are some good venues I can pursue. I'll post later on my progress.
    Thanks again,
    #22     Aug 15, 2001
  3. Hitman ----- I think I know (and use) what tymjr is referring to, but he's right: it won't be that much help to you for stock trading. You'd be better off simply watching the futures themselves as leading indicators, as I'm sure you do already.
    #23     Aug 15, 2001
  4. Hitman,
    You said:
    " First of all I would not recommend options trading, whether swing or intraday. If you are not very profitable with stocks, do not play with options. The increased leverage with the fact that you can not cut losses effectively with options unless hedged, can spell disasters during your learning curve. I really don't think options is a good day trading vehicle (Fohat, I think praetorian does swing trades and/or hedges with options, not his primary day trading vehicle for sure) because of the spreads, there are elites who can do it I am sure, but definitely not newbies."
    With all due respect, from your posts I figure that you have a lot more experience trading the markets than I do. However, I only agree with your statement above in part. In general, I concur that options are bad for intraday trading, at least not during these times when volatility has shrunk substantially. However, options can still be a good swing trading vehicle where you normally set out to capture larger moves in the markets, say, more than 1 1/2 points. I swing-traded stocks for a while, and my biggest nightmares were those overnight gap-ups and gap-downs that blew way past beyond my sell or buy stops. You only need a few of these mishaps to mess up your account pretty good. However, if I hold the option instead of the stock, the most I could lose is the premium I paid, which is far less than the underlying stock.
    Moreover, after trading options for a while, I find shorting the stock a lot more risky compared to buying an equivalent put option. For example, if you are playing the downside prior to an earnings release, you can short the stock. But if the stock gaps up 3 points on surprise good earnings, you might end up losing $300 per 100 shares. But I can buy a cheap out-of-the-money put, often times for as little as 40 or 50 cents per contract especially before option expiration. The most I could lose is $40 or $50 per contract.
    I always think that any trading vehicle, whether it be stock, option, or futures, carries its own unique type of risks. Ultimately, it is the PERSON who is risky, not the trading vehicle. That is to say, it is the person who doesn't know what he or she is doing that is risky.

    #24     Aug 15, 2001
  5. Hey guys remember the topic that was started here!

    #25     Aug 15, 2001
  6. tymjr


    No S/R. I have successfully used an indicator of my own design that would indicate when program buying/selling may be taking place. This is another leading indicator in addition to the original I mentioned.

    Top Secret Discovery makes it sound a lot more impressive than it really is. It’s based on some pretty basic concepts but the calculation is intensive. I got into trouble with my data provider for taxing the servers. It can’t be reproduced in AT or most packages for that matter.

    I’d be fascinated to find armaniman is looking at the same thing or a variation of this indicator. That’d be a real kick.

    I’m really regretting bringing this up ‘cause I sound like a real dork with this hush hush crap. It gives me an edge so I would like to keep it quiet. Who knows, I could tell you and you might say “ Hell, I knew that.” :)
    #26     Aug 15, 2001